The Couple's Table
The Couple’s Table is a weekly livestream podcast hosted by Heather Ramirez and Tom Buck. Join us, for better or worse, for richer or poorer, in sickness and in health, as long as we both shall podcast and stuff!
The Couple's Table
The Truth Behind Sponsored YouTube Content
Is the authenticity of YouTube sponsorships fading away? Join Heather and me, Tom, as we explore whether the pressures of money and brand deals are compromising the integrity of your favorite content creators. We'll examine how viewer discernment is reshaping the landscape of YouTube sponsorships, discussing the shift from organic endorsements to content that feels more like commercials. With personal anecdotes and audience contributions, we dissect what makes sponsorships feel genuine versus those that leave you skeptical.
We'll also dive deep into the ethical considerations and practical challenges of maintaining transparency in sponsored content. From the pressure to obscure sponsorship agreements to the constant struggle of updating tech setups, we discuss the thin line creators walk to keep their credibility intact. We share insights from our own experiences and tackle the controversies surrounding companies like Insta360, highlighting the importance of full disclosure to maintain trust.
Finally, we compare the expectations placed on YouTubers and traditional celebrities, underscoring the unique pressures faced by online creators. We'll talk about navigating the ethical gray areas of undisclosed marketing and the pitfalls of prioritizing profit over authenticity. Whether you’re a content creator yourself or a keen viewer, this episode offers a nuanced look at the complex world of YouTube sponsorships, providing valuable insights into why transparency and trust are more crucial than ever.
🟣 CONNECT WITH HEATHER —
My Vlog Channel: http://www.youtube.com/heatherjustcreate
My Tutorial Channel: http://www.youtube.com/heatherramirez
Instagram: http://www.instagram.com/heatherjustc...
Website: http://www.heatherjustcreate.com
🟣 CONNECT WITH TOM —
YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/tombuck
Instagram: @sodarntom
🟣 CONNECT WITH HEATHER —
My Vlog Channel: http://www.youtube.com/heatherjustcreate
My Tutorial Channel: http://www.youtube.com/heatherramirez
Instagram: http://www.instagram.com/heatherjustcreate
Website: http://www.heatherjustcreate.com
🟣 CONNECT WITH TOM —
YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/tombuck
Instagram: http://www.instagram.com/sodarntom
hello and welcome. My name is tom, who jeremy's wife does not dig wait what?
Speaker 2:this is the only stream that my wife will watch with me. Oh, that's like super cute. Sorry, I and I'm Heather.
Speaker 1:And you're sitting at the couple's table.
Speaker 2:The couple's table. I got this. I got this Ready set. Look at and boom. Sorry, I was posting the link on my Instagram stories, multitask. Okay, sorry, let's do it again. Hi, my name is Tom and I'm Heather, and you're sitting at the Couples Table the. Couples Table is a live stream podcast here on this channel. Join us for better or worse.
Speaker 1:For richer or poorer In sickness and in health Fridays 1 pm. Civic Standard Time that is today?
Speaker 2:How is the audio? How is the?
Speaker 1:audio. We checked it before it should be, I think I think we're good.
Speaker 2:Okay, guys, perker jennings in the house. What's up? Uh, jeremy, hello, hello. And cat, hey, hey, all right, hey, hey. What do you see? I am hyper today. Yeah, I know, I had a second cup of coffee. You're like cleaning your computer over here. I don't know I had a, I took a nap and then I had a down a coffee and here we are.
Speaker 1:Oh, I didn't do any of those things, yeah.
Speaker 2:I get on my level, See. This is why you're always yawning at the couples. It is yeah, Anyway, how are you doing Tom? Oh good, how are you? It is the last day of May.
Speaker 1:I know it sucks.
Speaker 2:Really. Yeah, I get excited for the first J month. Oh, because the second J month is my birthday, and then it also means school's out, summer's here.
Speaker 1:Yeah, take that. Teachers Can't tell me what to do.
Speaker 2:Oh, no coffee in the house. I just read your comment. Thank you for that. Shotgun Studios here. Happy. Oh, no coffee in the house. I just read your comment. Thank you for that. Shotgun studios here. Happy friday, and call me cubby, what's up? I like the firebird shirt I love. I uh, never wear the shirt for some reason it looks so good I know, you know what? Because it's a white shirt.
Speaker 1:But I put it on, I was like oh, white shirts are tough, but that's a good one, because it's also like most of it is the logo. Sometimes the white shirt is like actually I thought about it because we were.
Speaker 2:I told tom when we were getting ready that I was like my month is ending. He's like what do you mean? My month and it's the aapi asian american pacific islander month is is obviously the last day today, but then tomorrow is pride month and I was like, oh, I actually have a pride shirt yeah so then I you know, this is the thought process of getting ready for the couples.
Speaker 1:How dare you not stick to the exact dates that you are only allowed to celebrate these?
Speaker 2:level up with mike hello, hello. So are we gonna get into it today, tom?
Speaker 1:yeah, you're, I'm gonna let you, let you lead it, oh no. Are you yeah, why? I don't know.
Speaker 2:I feel like you know more about the conversation than I do.
Speaker 1:I don't know that I do.
Speaker 2:What did we title it? We said how YouTubers and sponsorships we're on the stream right now.
Speaker 1:We should know this, I know, but I mean like how I know, but I mean, like, how do YouTubers do sponsorships and brand deals? We cannot remember this title.
Speaker 2:I know Well, because we wanted to approach it from different angles.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you mentioned navigating it, so like how, I don't know you, can you know?
Speaker 1:you've shared how you yourself navigate brand deals and sponsorships, stuff. We've seen other people do, stuff you've seen you know. I think we're most curious about not just our own opinions but everybody else's opinions about sponsorships on youtube and what maybe you like, what you don't like, what's done well, what's not done well because it's not right off the bat. Let's just be clear it's not inherently bad, there's nothing wrong with it, but just like anything, well, let me ask you this.
Speaker 2:Let me ask you this so it seems like right now there is a bigger conversation around youtube creators and sponsorships, and it seems like right now there's something happening or there's some kind of shift or something. So yeah can you describe what, describe how it was done and why people are talking about this now?
Speaker 1:Well, I think the reason thank you, the reason people are talking about this now from a viewer's standpoint is, I feel like viewers have gotten very savvy and started to. When you're a YouTube creator and you start building up your channel, start seeing how things work the way I described it the other day on my live stream was you kind of like see the matrix. You sort of you can kind of tell what's happening, even if it's not super upfront. And I think viewers have gotten to that point. I think it's been long enough and enough. Viewers are creators themselves where they can kind of see the matrix and they've started to.
Speaker 1:They've started to really feel like, okay, it's one thing, for you know something to be given to for free or a thing to be sponsored, but now it's like we're just watching commercials, and not only do most people not just want to watch commercials, but it also feels disingenuous, it feels icky.
Speaker 1:It's like, you know, when your friend from high school sends you a message online that you haven't heard from in 10 years and then they try to like recruit you for an mlm, it's like, oh, you didn't want to reach out to me. You, you want me to sell your tupperware or whatever it is, and it's like it has that vibe of like you're using our relationship as viewer audience, the trust that you've built up over time, and now it feels like this. It feels dirty, and I think people have, I think the viewers it, I think a lot of creators who especially have done a lot of sponsored content. It has sucked the joy out of making stuff and suck the fun out of it and they want to find a different way to do it, and so it seems like, which is a good thing, it's a win, win if both sides are kind of feeling like this isn't working.
Speaker 2:What do we do differently?
Speaker 1:let's change this, then there's room to improve and figure new things out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's just's just what I think.
Speaker 1:I don't know, there's no quantitative research about that, but that's just what I've noticed.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you taught. You went live on your channel this week.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Tuesday.
Speaker 2:Super fun. Yeah you talked a little bit about this and one thing that you mentioned that I thought was interesting well, a lot of things, but I think one thing that I think is I don't know different about the conversation around sponsorships that's happening right now is that people are realizing that, like it's almost like the sponsor is dictating the content versus the creators dictating the content partnered with the sponsor and it's very subtle, but it's enough to change the dynamic of you know, fan to creator, viewer to creator.
Speaker 2:That's a good point, yeah so it's like you know, it's one thing. If I don't know, I don't know.
Speaker 2:I'm trying to think of an example, but like, oh yeah okay so, like you know, I have this microphone, I use it all the time, and then sure, yeah, I don't know. And then I talk about it versus versus a company saying, hey, we're coming out with this new microphone, talk about it when we launch, and here are the things that you need to say about it. When we launch, and hear the things that you need to say about it, which there's nothing wrong with that, but it's like would I have done that anyway?
Speaker 1:and a lot of it, I think, goes even a step further where it's not just that, because, hey, maybe they came out with like the new perfect microphone for you, and now you like it but a lot of times it goes down that route and then you'll never see the thing again oh, it's like and that's I think. I think that's where it's like, oh what? And then, as a viewer, you're confused because you're like wait, do you use that? Do you like that? Do you endorse that?
Speaker 2:so it seems like because I know this conversation is really like it's very nuanced and it seems like a lot of things are contributing, but even that, like a viewer never sees the thing in future videos. I don't even think that's intentional. But you know, like I don't think the creator is like I'm not gonna put this thing in it anymore.
Speaker 1:No, but I think that's where it comes.
Speaker 2:You know like I guess if you really bought something you needed, you would use it right that's, if it's a thing that you like, it's in in the camera niche of youtube.
Speaker 1:It happens all the time. New cameras come out and you see the wave of release videos and people claim it's the best thing ever, best thing ever. But you know the next videos after that they're back to using the same camera they were using before, and I've always been like I'm more interested in what you're using, not what you're telling me about. That I'm never gonna see again.
Speaker 1:Oh, I see, and especially from because it that that's where it's like and it's not even that's bad. I understand, like sometimes you just have stuff in your workflow and a new thing comes out and even if it is kind of better and even if it makes more sense, like you just don't want to uproot your workflow and change things around and what works works don't.
Speaker 1:if it ain't broke, don't fix it. The tricky part, though, is if it feels like it's this endorsement or whatever, from a viewer's standpoint. I know in the past it's happened to me where I've found somebody who I trusted they talk about something in a very genuine and authentic way which not only gives me like it's something I maybe I've been thinking about buying or getting into. Their endorsement might be the thing, that kind of like okay, that gives me the push to, like you know, press the submit order button on it and then you get the thing like this is really cool, and then you you go back to the person who recommended it and there's, it's never they're not using yeah, and you know, it sort of depends.
Speaker 1:I'm thinking my own channeling. Like I have a lot of different microphones. I'll do a mic review and you might not see that same microphone again for a while but it will pop up again. I I try to make it clear like I like microphones, so I switch through them a lot because they're all fun. Yeah, um, you know, and there's other things that are really specific. You know, like things I'm just thinking my own channel, but things like that, like okay, so here's an example you have like like nine guitars. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so it's the same thing. Your channel is not about guitars. There's no one needs that many guitars, obviously, but like the fact that you have like I mean, you told me this one has a very different sound, I can't tell the difference. But, there's an enthusiasm, which is why it's almost like you collect.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and the same thing with microphones. You can get pretty much any microphone, especially over 50 bucks or something, and especially if you can just add some eq to it, it's going to sound fine and it's going to probably be the only microphone you ever need done, we're done yeah, and you would be done. But it is fun to have different mics of different sounds. They maybe worked different ways. Interfaces they have different designs, different strengths and like, if you're someone who's interested in that, that's part of the fun, right? Like?
Speaker 2:that's part of the fun.
Speaker 1:And it kind of goes to that. And the thing that I think about which I know we need to check in with comments and stuff but the thing I'm thinking about too, is the opposite of this, which is like old school. I guess I still do it, some podcasts do it, some YouTube channels do it, but it's like the old school radio television way of doing sponsorships, where it's overt, it's like literally like now here's a break from our sponsor and it's very clear the host is you know, sometimes you could see this on TV shows. They are holding a script and they're like we'd like to thank you know Marlboro Cigarettes, like the smooth taste of smoky goodness, feed them to your kids. Doctor's choice Marlboro Cigarettes. And like you know that, whatever, like they're literally reading the script in front of you and to me, in a weird way, that's almost more honest.
Speaker 2:Right, because you're just telling it like it is.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and where I see that a lot on youtube right, okay, I see what it is, I see what it is where I see that a lot on youtube is in the like commentary entertainment channel niche, because someone will be like here's 20 ways that you know. Uh, what's his face? The guy ruined the star wars trilogy or something george lucas sure I was thinking of, like the new guy who did it I can't remember is jj abrams.
Speaker 1:Here's like 20 ways jj abrams killed star wars, like okay, and in the middle of that it's like but before we get the thing number whatever, here's a word from our sponsor. Like this meal prep service. It has nothing to do with star wars, there's nothing to do with the channel. Person talks about meal prep for 60 seconds. Sometimes they make it interesting. You know pewdiepie is going to talk about g fuel and the video is not about g fuel or anything that requires any sort of extra electrolytes or fuel and it's like in a weird.
Speaker 1:It's just like here's a sponsor. They paid me to tell you about them. I think there's. There should be the thing of the host uses it or like, or has at least tried it and liked it, and that's. That's sort of how it's been for a long time.
Speaker 1:So the difference is the review part the difference is the part where it's almost Because those kinds of things like I've heard those in the past for my whole life across media where people will say, like you know, maybe Pilot Pens sponsored this radio show, but maybe the host also either has bought and used them their whole life or they gave them a truckload of Pilot Pens. It's like these are great, these are what I use now. And so there is that endorsement, right, like you know, whatever it was and Britney Spears wasn't allowed to drink Coke because she was sponsored by Pepsi, that kind of thing. I think where it flips is where it's like that endorsement gets to a really blurry line and the person really feels like they are earnestly telling you about something they love when in reality they might not ever be mentioning it if there weren't some other thing going on behind the scenes and as a viewer.
Speaker 2:So complicated.
Speaker 1:That's very frustrating.
Speaker 2:Yeah, okay, so impressive, tony. Happy Friday, all excited for today's topic.
Speaker 2:I actually just received my first free review product for my new tech channel, so I'm ways away from Braindales being an issue. But hey, that's a milestone, yeah, that's a huge milestone, like that's a. I mean I remember I told the story before here, but I went to VidCon my first time. I was sitting in the front row for Zach King's talk and he was like like who here has gotten any kind of exchange from a business, a brand, a company, free products, anything, anything. You have gotten your first brand deal. Like you know, people put their hands up and he was like congratulations, you've gotten your first brand deal. That's like I don't know, it's like getting your first negative comment, like you made it right of passage.
Speaker 2:Yeah, uh, gil's here. Hello cat says. I remember your podcast last year, tom, about how it seems like brand launches have started driving the content schedule versus the creator yeah, that or I was talking about.
Speaker 1:They're in the driver's seat.
Speaker 2:You're not in the driver's seat of your channel andre says hi, jeremy says gerald, kofi coffee, chelsea, tony and a few others have gotten into it this week. All respectful, but everyone feels like the fuji trip was the kickoff for all this discussion I think the lumix trip.
Speaker 1:But yeah, I mean panasonic trip, but panasonic lumix are kind of the oh. Lumix is a camera company that's owned by panasonic shotgun studio says you don't know which reviews. Reviews are genuine anymore yeah yes, because pewdiepie is not reviewing g fuel, right like you're not reviewing hello fresh yeah, well, I mean, that's pretty obvious too when it's like we're gonna review best sports drinks and it's like surprise, the one who sponsored the video is the best one. You would expect that on the brand's website.
Speaker 2:Maybe you know like of course well, let me ask you this then Like why, Okay, genuine question, we need to catch up with the comments, but genuine question, why, Okay? Words Creators obviously work with sponsors and do brand deals because they need to get paid, Mm-hmm. Why don't they approach companies like HelloFresh or Squarespace or these other ones that are just? There's no review. There's no, it's like because it's out of your niche. You're not speaking at it from an angle of I'm kind of an enthusiast or expert in cameras or whatever. It's clear this person is the sponsor. They've enabled this video by paying for it, and then this is not even an issue.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I think that's, I think that's tricky because also a lot of companies you know finding companies in or out of your niche that are willing to sponsor stuff and pay you well and treat you well and whatever your requirements are. Like I have my whole ethics.
Speaker 2:Like you drink Coke every day.
Speaker 1:I know Coke's not going to sponsor you, but Coke might say yeah, we'll sponsor you, We'll give you $500 for 10 videos and 16 reels or something, and it's like well, that is just.
Speaker 2:I know, but like what if you found someone that was comparable? I mean, you'd have to do the legwork to do it.
Speaker 1:And the fact is, like most creators, even if they thought they wanted to do brand deals when they started their channel, they probably weren't equipped to do it and they've sort of stumbled and fallen into it and are navigating it, sort of stumbled and fallen into it and are, you know, navigating it, and I think at least in camera, youtube right now. Um, a thing that's happened is, I think, a lot of people sort of found themselves in these situations, not because they got into them consciously, because they made these decisions, like I'm gonna say, but it's just sort of. They said yes to a lot of things over a long period of time and sort of didn't realize the corner.
Speaker 1:This is the way that it's always been done, and this is the way to do it and and this is what I see other people do, so it's okay and you know it, yeah ono coffee says.
Speaker 2:I've always been critical of reviewers to determine who to trust.
Speaker 1:I think gerald does is very trustworthy reviews, but his recent video sounded more like gripes that he wasn't invited to japan, especially since in the video he bragged about how he doesn't make videos when he goes on a sponsored trip by the company the thing that I want to emphasize, especially as someone who has been very like anti, you know, like brand unfriendly and not a content way, but in a personality way, um is I actually don't fault any of the brands for any of this like a brand is. I think we should be super clear, which I think we touched on this last week a little bit too. Brands are supposed to market their products.
Speaker 2:Brands are supposed to I mean, but who thinks that it's the company's fault? Do people actually think that?
Speaker 1:Yeah, oh, yeah, especially at least in this whole thing that's happened here. Brand is supposed to market their stuff. A brand is, of course, going to tell you all the ways that their stuff is great. That's what they do and that's like. That's fine, it's, it's your I don't even say your job, because everybody's different. If you're approaching it as a journalist, you do have a different responsibility than an enthusiast, than a hobbyist, than a whatever. But it's your job to figure out how you want to approach something, approach it in that way and then make that clear to your audience. And if somebody is boasting that they don't participate in very expensive trips for products and the brand says okay, let's not invite that person anymore because we're essentially just flushing money away, that's fine well, I think the reason why uh people are blaming companies in this round is because the you know, like insta 360 was axed asking on the heels of that yeah, asking creators to not disclose that a sponsorship agreement had been made which is illegal, like yeah, I think that, and then against terms of
Speaker 1:service illegal like that is wrong, straight up yeah, and that that this was right on the heels of that, at least in this one niche. You know this stuff has happened in different niches and different mediums for many, many years, but it was like sort of like the perfect storm of things to get people looking more critically at this right now.
Speaker 2:I find that more reputable reviewers fully disclose relationship, but there is more weight given to those who pay for their own product.
Speaker 1:I mean, paying for your own thing is the easiest way to avoid everything. You gain credibility, you have nothing to worry about. But what I can say is, depending on what your channel is, it literally just isn't practical all the time. And so, rather than kind of get into it here, I did do a podcast episode, maybe like a month ago. It's called To Shill or Not To Shill it. Here I did do a podcast episode, maybe like a month ago. It's called To Shill or Not To Shill, no-transcript.
Speaker 1:I need to not pay for stuff. That makes sense, like it's not really justifying, like, but I need to have free things. But it dives into the relationship between the creator and the audience. And when the creator has the audience trust and respect and the audience grows and the audience wants that person's point of view and perspective on things, it could be the creator's, you know, in a way, their I don't say responsibility, but their decision to try to serve those people in their audience as good as possible. And that might mean, okay, now I will, you know, accept something, talk about something, evaluate something, review something that I might not have otherwise. Specifically for these people who care about what I do otherwise, specifically for these people who care about what I do and if I bought all of the things that people want me to do?
Speaker 2:that, for I would go broke. Yeah, and so that you know, there's that part of it uh andre says to be honest, I have no problem with creators doing sponsored not sponsored sponsored launch videos. It's so easy to see, understand when that's the situation, but I find it interesting when og youtubers who have made their career and channels based on earning cash from camera reviews suddenly advise younger, up-and-coming youtubers to not do it right yeah homesick man. I totally take it back. And no one needs nine guitars. How many do you have?
Speaker 1:yeah, uh, that's what because that's what we're talking about. You said the term gas because you you were like, oh my gosh, like I've seen so many people talk about gas and like the you know the, the camera streaming niche, like everyone has gas for new gear, um, and I was like, oh, the first time I heard that term, that I heard it was back in like 2001, when I started playing guitar and I went on an online message board that I spent so much time on and everybody of message board that I spent so much time on and everybody, of course, like once you get one guitar you need another guitar.
Speaker 1:It's just how it works so interesting and every. That's where everyone talked about gas. There was even like a forum on there called like the gas forum or something look at benny hi.
Speaker 2:What is it?
Speaker 1:you got gas, buddy, do you have gas?
Speaker 2:do you want new gear? Oh, I don't know what.
Speaker 1:He came here I think he wants to go under the table do you want to want, you can go under the table.
Speaker 2:I don't know what to do. Okay, mike says microphones are like t-shirts, shoes and hats. I may have a favorite I love, but I won't wear the same shirt every time I go out. I will change it up. Yeah, that's a great way to put it actually yeah, I can see that gil says I hate and love rethinking my work flow. It takes a lot to redo a setup. So when I see creators promote a new computer or software every week, I'm like how the heck are they so efficient? And I'm not.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, I think about that with Marques Brownlee, who I love and he's very clear because he covers like every smartphone that's out there and he does iOS and Android. So he said that he has like two phones on him at all times and usually sticks with each one for about I don't like three weeks to a month or something. So it's like new phone okay, I'm gonna use this and that is his phone his iphone or his android phone for that month and he switches and I always think like the nightmare of setting up a new phone every couple weeks I know I mean it's like, but you just back it up now and yeah, I know, know, but still, even still, there's always little things where it's like I got to redo this setting and change this.
Speaker 2:Gil says everything does seem like an ad now and I really don't like that. Kat says I agree about the traditional ad. We know exactly what it is. The video isn't trying to sell us, it's simply sponsored. I think people got to the point too. It was like we knew about traditional ads so we skipped them. We went out of the room when commercials came on. We I know, but they still work like heck. Earlier I won a dairy queen because of the stanley cup playoffs, like oh yeah, we were watching a game.
Speaker 1:We're watching a hockey game. The other day I think it was a fibers game, and the other team had a player named o'reilly and I just kept thinking O-O-O Like advertising works.
Speaker 2:That's why it's like if the sponsor's just trying to sell.
Speaker 1:But if a company's going to say, hey, our very obvious commercial comes on and people walk out of the room. What if somebody was able to hold their attention a little more and actually get them to hear what we're trying to say?
Speaker 2:Well, see, here, here's the thing that I mentioned in this, in the video I put out yesterday. But I feel like, uh, I feel like the sponsors are just doing what they do. Like you said, there's a business, is a business, a brand, a company is going to sell their products, like obviously, obviously, uh and if you think that's weird, clearly you have not been a business owner yourself, like we have this is what is the point of a business is to sell the product that you created. So obviously, um, but I think the way that it's being done right now is obviously not. I think there's a better way. I don't know what that way is, but I'm curious, like you know alternative ways. I guess, yeah, way, I don't know what that way is.
Speaker 1:But I'm curious, like you know alternative ways, I guess yeah, like I don't know.
Speaker 2:I feel like the creators, like let's stop, let's push, pause and for a second, let the creators come up with a better way for everyone to win yeah for sponsors to be able to sell their ad things. For creators to be able to be creative and and maintain the integrity and you know, uh, what is it called authenticity with their audience, and to have fun and, like, everyone wins yeah I don't think the sponsor is going to come up with that no, they're.
Speaker 2:They're not because they're just going to do the thing that's been done, yeah, and so, like I don't know, I feel like there's there's ways, you know it's.
Speaker 1:I mean, it involves a lot of self-introspection to figure out what works for you and your audience and it also involves a lot of communication with the brand.
Speaker 1:And you know like, it involves a lot more than than just sort of like because it was.
Speaker 1:The thing is, once your channel gets to a certain point which I mean doesn't even have to be that huge you start getting unsolicited brand things you know like for everything. You know I've gotten eyelash serum requests, I got a desk jewelry, you got a flexi spot desk one this morning like stuff that's not even necessarily related to what you do and I I, what I have been shocked with in the past, maybe year, is to figure out how many creators who I view is very savvy and experienced essentially click yes and engage in every single one of those and will sometimes agree to do a sponsored thing. And then reach out to other people and go like hey, do you know anything about this company? Because I said I do a sponsored thing. And then reach out to other people and go like, hey, do you know anything about this company? Because I said I do a sponsored thing for them and like is it good or whatever? And it's like, why would you agree? I know that's so backward but then that's where it's like.
Speaker 2:This is where we all need to get together.
Speaker 1:That's yeah that's a level of like. You're gonna have a lot of headaches there because you run the risk of now having to ignore something that sucks. You're probably not getting. You're probably getting taken advantage. It's probably an unfair deal. It's probably a boilerplate agreement that you got that takes what you do not into account at all.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:And now you're kind of on the hook for it. And if you do that type of thing many, many times over, it's no wonder that you're gonna feel like maybe I'm not having fun doing this anymore yeah, kombucha's here, dave den hello homesick mac, gotta admit.
Speaker 2:After buying more than tell bellroy bags products and using them as every gig carry, it'd be natural for me to try to get a brand deal of some kind yeah, I mean yeah see, exactly, exactly there's stuff where it's and that's where it's like. I think it's okay to unless, especially, if it's something they use all the time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah unless you're taking the role of a journalist a journalist who is supposed to be objective and neutral and just talk about a thing. I don't think a lot of youtube creators are trying to take that role I think that's the point.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean that is, that we can be ourselves.
Speaker 1:Yeah and that that's what I agree with, and so there's nothing wrong with having a bias. It's just acknowledging your bias like road, isn't? I know I'm talking to a sanitizer microphone right now, but road is one for me where it's like it wouldn't be unreasonable for someone to say I don't know tom's kind of biased towards road, which in a way makes me more critical of them. But I also understand why someone might see me make a video where I say something positive about a road product and they want to go, maybe watch another video from someone else to see if it lines up.
Speaker 1:I totally get that. But on the flip side, I've been using road gear since years. Before I had a youtube channel like it really didn't save my butt when I was a teacher. It, uh, they, they saved me, not just because the gear was good and worked, but even when stuff broke, even out of warranty, um, they would replace it, which saved me so much time, money, frustration, as, like a teacher, trying to run this program. And then when I started doing youtube stuff because that's what I use at work, that's what I bought personally and then it was literally.
Speaker 1:I remember a day where I was just like, oh my god, like everything in here is just a road thing. It was not intentional, but then I was like, wow, I think I like road and that and so there's nothing wrong with then. I've never had a paid brand deal with road, but there's nothing wrong with then me kind of having a bias and going, yeah, if I have two options for something, I'm going to lean towards the road one, probably because of all those reasons. Other people might not have that experience or those reasons and as long as I'm up front about that, I don't think that's a problem, yeah I think everybody does that in their life yeah, of course.
Speaker 1:Like what car do you drive? You know, do you just go whatever dealership you happen to drive by? That's the brand of car you drive?
Speaker 2:you probably have a brand that you're kind of like this I like that kind of car or whatever uh, tony says to tom's point on people not understanding how to navigate brand deals spot on, could really use a master class for template templates on how to handle the business of youtube. Feels like we're all just winging it absolutely yeah everyone's winging it and then like there's no one to ask, and even when you do ask, people are very close to the chest with it, like it's very hush-hush for some reason.
Speaker 1:Well, that's a hard thing too. Is then you end up with like you end up potentially undervaluing yourself and and that's again.
Speaker 2:that's not the company's fault, they're just doing what they do.
Speaker 1:Yeah well, I mean, it's the same thing. It's also their job, not only doing marketing, but they want to spend as little money as possible. Yeah, most bang for their buck if we could get if we could sponsor three people instead of taking that budget and sponsoring one person with it yeah let's try to pay three people less like that's of course what they're going to do uh, let's see.
Speaker 2:Andre says the lumix thing probably wouldn't have been a thing if it weren't for the insta 360 thing.
Speaker 1:Lumix type situations have been going on for years yeah, I mean, that's what I think people suddenly started because with the insta thing, I know what I did and what I've read other people have done too is like, specifically with the x4, which is the camera that a lot that kicked this off. A lot of people went back and looked at the launch day, the wave of x4 videos, and saw who. Who in the video said it was sponsored, who in the description said it was sponsored, who in the description said it was sponsored, who marked the sponsored thing. And it's like in those cases there was not only a product but also money that changed hands. All of those things technically should have been done and very few people did all of them and there was a number of people and you can just go find the videos yourself right now.
Speaker 1:There's a number of people who don't really make any mention of it and you would kind of never really know it was a sponsored thing, but see, okay, so let me freaking ask you this why? I don't know Like why is it?
Speaker 2:I don't understand like what? Why do you have to hide it? Why is it like a thing that you have to hide? Does it make the thing more legit?
Speaker 1:Well, yeah, I mean, that's why Insta asked people, because they literally said it's more authentic and genuine if it's not sponsored?
Speaker 2:I don't think that's true. Is that true?
Speaker 1:I think that people have abused their audience's trust enough to the point where people are dubious audience's trust enough to the point where people are dubious. And I know, like the thing, that the thing that's really frustrating is if someone sends you I don't know, a $25 mic windscreen, you have to check the you know whatever sponsored content button on YouTube. If someone pays you $100,000, you have to check the same box on YouTube and there is zero contextualization for what that box means. You get the same notice on each thing and there is zero contextualization for what that box means. You get the same notice on each thing. And sometimes that is frustrating when it's like, okay, maybe even a secondary thing that's in this video was provided, so I have to check that box.
Speaker 2:It's not even the point of the video.
Speaker 1:But now there is, I feel, baggage on that video because and the icon that pops up is literally a hand taking a stack of money, like it might as well just be a money, like a bag with a dollar sign on it, and it's like, okay, uh, I I feel like you have to win, you you already have to. Then you should make that notification, you should make that clear. But the way that you have to do it now, you have to, like, earn back some credibility and trust by doing that, and I think a lot of people are just like I'm not going to do that and and people I've heard people justify it In all, kinds of different ways a way of like you know, yeah, they might not have paid me and I got the thing for free, but I had to put in the time to make the video.
Speaker 1:I had to spend the years building the experience.
Speaker 2:You check the box, buddy, and it's like we all know what the box is intentionally made for right.
Speaker 1:I mean youtube's pretty clear I I feel like I would love to see more nuance in it, but currently it says if you received anything of value to make this video, check the box yeah, but that because that's youtube's box.
Speaker 2:Youtube is a third party between the sponsor and you, so they don't care. They just for you know the to meet their legal things, they need to have a box. It is a box.
Speaker 1:They don't care so here's a here's an example. Do you know if you, if, if you're a creator in the amazon affiliate program? Okay that's a lot of creators right like okay, if you can have an affiliate link to amazon okay there are very specific rules that amazon has.
Speaker 1:You cannot say specific prices. You cannot show amazon web pages and product listings. You cannot use the amazon logo in your thumbnails. You cannot put prices in your thumbnails. You cannot use hyperbolic language like best, worst, worst, most, least. How many videos do you see where people do that? I bought the most, I bought the least, I bought the worst on Amazon. And they have the Amazon logo and they have the five-star rating and they have a dollar sign price amount right there or they show the product listing. If you're not an Amazon affiliate, it doesn't matter, but if you are an Amazon affiliate, they can take your status away because you're not supposed to do that. And I think their reasoning is stuff changes so much they don't want your permanent video to be like this item?
Speaker 2:is this price at this rate, four years later?
Speaker 1:yeah, um, and you might say like, well, okay, it doesn't matter because it's not enforced, just like the youtube button, that's youtube's thing. If it ran, you never know. And I say this because three years ago I got dinged on an Amazon thing where I didn't even. It was a thing where I had made a video that was comparing boom arms and maybe six minutes into the video no, maybe not six minutes minutes into the video I said, oh, this boom arm is like $25 and this one's like whatever. I didn't show the Amazon page or anything. That got me in trouble and almost like booted from the program.
Speaker 1:So, and I think it was just a random thing, I think it's just a random audit of things and I don't know how youtube works. Point being, it's probably a good idea to be above board and follow the rules, understand the rules that you're supposed to follow, so that, even though you can look around and be like, hey, everyone else on this freeway is speeding, it doesn't really matter if the cop is driving behind you and puts the radar gun at you right, yeah, uh, let's see, ernesto is here.
Speaker 2:Happy friday. How many guitars do we need one more? Y'all think I'm just buying guitars. I got my latest exactly eight years ago.
Speaker 1:Ain't buying anything soon I haven't bought anything in two years. I haven't bought my. Two years ago I bought my bass and prior to that, it was 2020 is when I bought my last guitar.
Speaker 2:Sounds like a recovery program. Endorsements have always been effective, but used to be too expensive. But now creators are affordable compared to major celebrities, so brands are incentivized to go after their endorsements.
Speaker 1:You used to have to pay Britney Spears a massive amount to talk about Pepsi.
Speaker 2:You just have to send someone a free camera. Andre says one solution would be to give creators enough to be creative with a product and show the results rather than bullet point showcase videos. Yeah, uh. Ernesto says my son has been telling me about how there's videos of logan paul opening a prime drink but never drinks. It just opens to promote his drink. I don't blame him for promoting his drink.
Speaker 1:I love that I don't put that crap in my mouth uh, spiral Lab is here.
Speaker 2:Hello, thanks for being here. I trust a person that promotes something that also uses the product. Of course, ono Coffee says if they didn't disclose a relationship like a free trip to Japan, then that creator is untrustworthy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, that's a big one.
Speaker 2:Well, I just don't get like why do you?
Speaker 1:I mean but why yeah, why, why do you?
Speaker 2:have to hide it. I don't understand, like why. I don't understand how you don't see that transparency is the key to sustainability for everything like I. I don't understand like, fine, this might this, might you? You, you might think like, okay, let's not hide it now, but just it, it'll compound. And then all of a sudden you're stuck yeah like if you're just transparent, you never, never you. It's like future proofing I there.
Speaker 1:I talk about one of my, and like why is it?
Speaker 2:why is it shady? Like isn't that cool that you got to be invited to this incredible thing? Go have fun, yeah, go. Why does it have to be shady? Exactly, but why are we?
Speaker 1:I'm like asking well, okay, one of my favorite old school youtube channels was dave dugdale learning dslr video. I've talked about him a lot lately because I really loved the way that he did things and he was super active from like 2010 to maybe 2016, 2017. And that was a time before YouTube sponsorship, brand deals, partner program was what it is now, and I remember, as his channel kind of developed, it was based around his own skills learning how to do video. As that developed, he got into the computer side of things, the editing software, which involved him like building his own computers, and I remember specifically the brand Asus, the computer computer brand, like the pc brand. Um, he bought some stuff from them, was doing some tests, and I remember he made videos where he like was like, oh uh, asus reached out to me and was telling me about like they have these new things, like this graphics card or process I don't know what they make, but computer parts, um, he's like they have this one and this one.
Speaker 1:They're gonna send me this thing or some company. I think think it was. That company Could have been a different company, but, point being, it wasn't even like. It was just so organic in terms of he was like, hey, I've been talking about stuff, I use this. They saw my video. They reached out, they told me about this. They let me, they sent this to let me try. And he's trying it and he's explaining like oh, this one seems to be working, this one doesn't seem to be working. And he would even say like okay. So I asked the engineer at the company.
Speaker 1:So ultimately, what you ended up with was several videos about the same computer company and the same computer parts. But it didn't. It's not even that didn't feel sponsored, it just wasn't. It was transparent. It was just I've been making videos about this stuff. The company reached out to me. Here's the dialogue I've been having with them. I like their stuff, I want to use their stuff. This is me talking to them about it and I don't know I felt like that was just such a cool way to do it. It's like I didn't feel like, oh, you shill, like you're just. Why aren't you evaluating every other product, because that's the other thing too is like you might want to just talk about the thing that you like. I don't necessarily want to evaluate every competing product. Like I want to talk about the road caster, I don't want to talk about the 15 clone casters.
Speaker 2:Well, because normal people don't do that. I don't understand why.
Speaker 1:But my point being is that was kind of an old school thing that was very clear, very transparent and seemed to work for everybody. I didn't have weird feelings about it. It didn't seem like anyone else did.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And I don't know why that went away. That way of doing things went away went away.
Speaker 2:Oh, andre says some people will think something is the creator's own opinion. Legit review if it's not marked, labeled as such.
Speaker 1:Yes, and in in this most current dust up, I've seen a lot of creators almost blame the audience and I do not like that at all. Where they're like the audience should know it's obvious the audience no, it it's obvious. The audience no, it's not obvious. Because we don't just watch your channel. We watch lots of other videos. You're just one of many and it's hard to like sit here and decipher and contextualize and if you can just be honest and open about what you're doing, it really kind of makes it better for everybody.
Speaker 2:Okay, everybody okay. So I guess the way that this all got messed up is uh uh. So if it's marked as sponsored, it automatically makes it not genuine.
Speaker 1:I think it creates a hurdle to overcome. I do, and so people don't want to mark the thing as sponsored, but they want to work with companies.
Speaker 2:For some reason like yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 1:I mean, that's just that's from I know. That's how I feel every time I check that box, especially if it's something that's like this is kind of dumb when it's like you know, tony Stark can pull up with the whatever, the Audi logo like front on the freaking imax screen, no one says anything. No box checked there. But like god forbid, like you know, use some like peripheral um. But if everybody's playing by the same rules. That problem is not really a problem anymore.
Speaker 2:Some bad apples have ruined it. Where you know, money exchanged hands and then so it was biased like, yeah, straight up biased where I don't know. Maybe it was like you were hiding things that you know they're clearly is a flaw and you're not pointing it out because the company is telling you to focus on these bullet points instead I mean and so that get that that stink kind of spreads to the whole, to everybody else.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Because one person watches one or two of those videos and then they, just now, anytime they hear anybody say somebody sent me this, they just like, oh, you're doing that same thing the other person did, even if you're absolutely not.
Speaker 2:Yeah, mike says also, not just sponsored issues, but also requesting biased reviews for gifts. Yeah, make this video in exchange for this product andre says this video is lightly sponsored with breadcrumbs and wood. Pearls should be an option for youtube videos.
Speaker 1:I mean, it would be cool. I did see, I did see someone suggest some contextualization like paid endorsement, I think is the button on, and then a sub option to check like accommodations provided, product provided, payment received, like that way there could be contextualization of, like what I know, youtube doesn't.
Speaker 2:But why does it matter though? Like what is the difference between you received accommodations versus you got paid the same amount as the cost of the accommodations? Like who cares as a viewer?
Speaker 1:I think the difference is did I get a $400 camera or did I get a week-long trip to Japan?
Speaker 2:I think those are different, or, in the case of one, yeah, but then what if you go to the trip to Japan or you get, get the 400 camera plus four thousand dollars?
Speaker 1:right, well, I mean. That's why it's like paid sponsorship, free product travel and accommodations but why would that change?
Speaker 2:I'm I'm just like, genuinely, I'm just asking, like, is the viewer gonna be like, oh okay, this was accommodation, so it's legit?
Speaker 1:no, it's just like I don't understand what, how that would help, I guess I mean I don't think it's gonna, if anything, I don't think it's gonna help things seem legit. I think it's gonna help people identify less legit things, because I I know of one very specific company that is quite litigious and I'm not going to say anything about them what did you just say? They're quite litigious.
Speaker 2:Litigious. I've never heard this word in my life. You know, I've been together with Tom for what? Eight years, seven, eight years. I've known you and sometimes he'll just say a word that I've never even heard in my entire life and you just had this one in your vocab.
Speaker 1:Boberigmus, there we go, litigious, litigious, litigious. What does that mean? Uh, prone to taking legal action? Wow, um, sorry, who? When they have a new product that comes out, lots of people get the new product. Lots of people get the new product plus payment. And in the videos you watch it is very unclear. You, you cannot tell who is who because some reason, when working with this specific company, people don't go out of their way to disclose the payment side of things, which I know can be massive, five figures in some cases. And so you could be watching someone who got a $300 item, or you could be watching someone who got a $300 item plus a down payment on a house.
Speaker 1:Oh, I mean, yeah, $10,000, $20,000, $30, item plus a three thousand a down payment on a house. Oh, you know, like I mean, I'm, yeah, ten, twenty, thirty thousand, maybe more, um, and you don't know, and I don't know how everyone's checking the box but you all check the same box and it is weird and I don't.
Speaker 1:I don't know that the company, in this case, is telling people not to disclose it. They're're just saying, hey, this is a sponsored thing, you check the box, whatever. But as the creator, it is weird when you say like, oh, company, thanks company for providing the thing.
Speaker 2:So see to me, based on how you're describing this, I feel like if there's anybody to blame, it just it seems like it's creators, it's some of these creators.
Speaker 1:Oh, I would say so. I would absolutely say so, a thousand percent. And some of it is, some of it is on purpose, where people are consciously not including stuff, and those are the bad apples, those are the people who are ruining it. For the rest of it, some of it is just ignorance, like you didn't know anybody because you didn't. You didn't get into this to navigate this world of business sponsorships and now you're like in the middle of this and you're trying to figure it out. So you might make mistakes or hiccups here or there, or you might look and see what everyone else is doing and copy. Someone who's like acting in bad faith, I don't really blame. Yeah, I guess that's where I'll stop is there more?
Speaker 2:oh, there's a lot more uh cat says they hide because as soon as money changes hands, the review can be biased I mean, yeah, and that's.
Speaker 1:You know, that's the thing that people have said ad nauseum something's paid. It can't be a review. I agree, I did a sponsored sennheiser video at the beginning of last year. I've talked those four. Um, if that had been a microphone that I bought and made a review for it, it would be the exact same video, and I know that.
Speaker 1:I know the video wouldn't change but yeah but the fact that they paid me means it does not make sense to call that a review, because that word has a connotation to it. That means something. So it's one thing to call it a showcase, a highlight, a demo, like whatever. Those are all things that it can be when it's paid and it's okay. Review is different because that's, you know, like You're implying it's a personal opinion.
Speaker 2:It's a personal opinion.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're implying a level of being removed from the company and objectivity to some degree, and you know, to some degree.
Speaker 2:See this is why I think we shouldn't be using these words that a thousand percent is sponsored. So many people who've been sponsored will use review. They'll call it a review.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I mean, and people, and so will viewers. Like someone can say like here's a product showcase. They check all the boxes, they do all the things. But someone's gonna say like, oh, I saw that review. Like they're just gonna call it a review. It's a person talk about a product. Therefore it's a review. It's shorthand, you know. It makes sense, so that's that's where it gets mucked up and I don't think there is a solution to that because there's too many people, too many circumstances, too many things going on, but it's, you know, I don't know. That's where it's. When I see that there are people essentially sorry the analogy I've used is taking a dump in their own living room and then complaining the whole place smells like poo I don't have a lot of sympathy.
Speaker 1:And I feel like there's a significant amount of that. Creators who are like you kind of, are to blame for your own problems and not even your problems, because what you do reflects on everybody else and affects everybody else. And now, like you, burned your audience and they come over to my channel already burned oh, I see, oh tom talk about it.
Speaker 2:I see, okay, I see, I didn't know this, I didn't realize this I don't know if I knew it either. I think I'm discovering these feelings too andre says I think the youtube sponsored checkbox is for tubers to more easily mark their videos. Follow local rules, like here in Norway, it's the law, so checking the box means one is compliant.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean the FCC specifically says it might not be enough.
Speaker 2:Because here's the thing YouTube does not give an F about sponsorships because it's literally money that is not like exchanging with them.
Speaker 1:They don't make money off your sponsorships.
Speaker 2:Exactly so. It's like, of course, they're doing what they need to do to stay compliant as a business and that's the bare minimum that they're going to do. Otherwise, they're going to the. The things that they're going to work on are trying to make their product, the youtube products, better for creators, better for viewers yeah, look how specific.
Speaker 1:If you go on youtube and you upload a video and you you turn on ads, you have to go through like 12 boxes. Does it include this? If so, to what degree? This, this, like all these things.
Speaker 2:Okay, this yeah. So yeah for their AdSense, if you received money outside of YouTube.
Speaker 1:they don't give a crap, Just check this little box or whatever.
Speaker 2:So yeah, obviously they know. But yeah, KY Harman says it's like that adage it's easier to keep up with the truth than a lie.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Same would apply to sponsorships. It's easier to keep up with the truth than a lie. A hundred percent.
Speaker 1:And it's something you can be proud of, like if you.
Speaker 2:That's what I'm saying, that's why I don't understand why you would hide a trip to Japan. Yeah thing.
Speaker 1:I don't know how many people I think it might be like 20 people or something you can find people who I think, did it very well and were just open and honest about stuff. They not only talked about the product that they were there to like check out, but then they also like talked about their trip to Japan and made it very human and very personable and we're even grateful of like it was really cool. I got to do this because now I got to go to this place, I couldn't have gone otherwise and you know, some people did it really well and you can do that.
Speaker 2:It's just other people didn't do it very well and yeah, Mike says got here late, but how about a public-facing sponsorship contract be shown in the video itself? I also think including monetary payments wouldn't be as suspicious with the radical honesty itself.
Speaker 1:Like kind of putting the fine print in the video To me, me like. It's not that I wouldn't be on board with that, I would. My hesitation would just be that like it would be so distracting from the topic of like, which is why it goes back to like. If you can just do anything that's not sponsored, it's so much easier.
Speaker 2:But you know you need to make money and make a living and what you know I just don't think like sponsored should equal inherently bad company should is inherently bad and I feel like for some reason it's the conversation I'm getting the impression that it is, but to me it seems like it's. It's more of like certain, a few creators, that kind of and in some cases again, it's not intentional, it's right, of course, these situations, of course, yeah, we're not trained prepared?
Speaker 1:yeah, or anything, just sort of like oh my, what happened? How am I in this circumstance?
Speaker 2:andre says honestly, I think youtubers think marking something as sponsored is bad. Well, most people don't even think about it, other than a very loud minority that minority is very loud.
Speaker 1:But I think you're spot on that like it is a minority. Like you know, I get kind of nervous. I've done I did a sponsored video like a week ago, not a week ago, a month ago, um, and I always get nervous. It was. It was for a thing that wasn't related to the video. It was in a boom arm comparison video. There was an art list sponsorship, so totally different um, and I was I always just you know like I hope people aren't upset that there's like this 60 second thing in the middle. Not one person said anything, you know like, so most people just really don't care or they're used to it or whatever. But I think it is how you handle it.
Speaker 2:Kat says, even if you try not to be biased, if you accept a sponsorship, you are in a partnership of sorts with this company.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and just being honest about that, like you know, I don't know, just I mean, it's the same thing.
Speaker 2:It's like, if you're genuine, like I love playstation, why would I hide that? Yeah, I mean, oh, yes, I will be biased to playstation talk to people about why they play fender versus gibson.
Speaker 1:That's gonna like I don't really open up a can of worms I guess.
Speaker 2:I guess the the, the I don't know shady part is. What is a shady part? The shady part is if I'm, if I'm lying or not being like, if I'm not being, if the company has told me to say something I don't know, I'm getting confused.
Speaker 1:It's how transparent you're being.
Speaker 2:Doc says litigious is a very common word. I've never heard of it before.
Speaker 1:Ironically, HR departments can be very litigious.
Speaker 2:Mike says some people were commenting on my video. Nobody cares, just shut my mouth and just review products. Be very litigious, mike says some people were commenting on my video. Nobody cares, just shut my mouth and just review. Just review products. Makes me ask myself am I in the minority or majority? With honesty and transparency?
Speaker 1:yeah, I mean it. Doc was actually someone who helped me. I I credit him often with this. Um, I think it depends. I think you're probably doing things the better way, mike, of being honest and transparent. But I know something that I used to do a lot was I used to dive into a lot of depth with, like you know, which, by the way, everything using today, all of this stuff is stuff we paid for. It was sent for free. But in a case where, say, a microphone was sent out, I would say like, oh, company sent this microphone to me and you know, like they asked for want to do this and I said yes, and it was because of this and this, but I'm not. I really had my disclaimer, but it was really long. So I was trying to address every one of those comments that was coming that I could imagine coming in, and Doc was someone who was like look, the people who love your channel and care about you and support you, we don care about you and support you. We don't care about all that.
Speaker 2:Well, they're giving you the benefit of the doubt.
Speaker 1:They're giving you the benefit of the doubt, those people who are going to give you crap. They don't care about what you do anyway, they're going to watch this one video, complain, leave and never come back.
Speaker 1:They're not subscribed, so don't take time away from us, the people who care about what you do, to try to satisfy them. And so I still disclose stuff because not only is it just good and transparent, it is a requirement, at least in the US, to verbally disclose these things, not just check the box. But it can be very quick. You know, like company sent this thing, I'm under no obligation to say anything about it. I know that's a common thing and people have their opinion. I don't say this, but I know that's a common thing and people have their opinion about it. In my case it is true, and I think in most cases it's probably pretty true, and then that's kind of it. In my case, I do have the ethics statement on the website and a video version of the ethics statement, and so I link to the website in the description and then I also always like not always, but most of the time put a what is it? A card to the ethic statement video at that part too.
Speaker 1:So it's like here's the basics if you want to dive in and put yourself to sleep reading about all this other stuff, here you go, um which, of course, the people are going to levy those criticisms are never going to do that, but at least they can't say I didn't provide everything uh, some viewers don't trust that a review is not influenced by the free thing they're getting.
Speaker 2:It's why employers make you sign agreements that you can't accept gifts from customers but I mean the thing.
Speaker 1:The thing is, I think, like going back to like we're not everyone is a journalist. Let's go back to guitars. If I know someone is a super fan of fender guitars and has played them for years and talks about it for years, and now they get to go tour the fender factory, right, I know that they're going to I know they're probably only going to say cool things and they're going to pick up all the guitars of things like look at this beautiful finish and look how great this sounds.
Speaker 1:I, I don't really care. I kind of want that right, like I'm probably watching them at that point because I'm also a Fender fan.
Speaker 2:And I want to, I kind of want to share the thing about that we're excited about.
Speaker 1:I don't want to see them go and be like well you know, the workmanship isn't what it used to be back in the day, and these machines and the like. I don't want that.
Speaker 2:So what happened? What is the difference Like? Why?
Speaker 1:I don't know. I mean it's everything got mucked up because there you have the journalist side of thing, where a journalist would go okay, company did a press release on new product. Let's look at the new product. You like consumer reports? Back in the day where it was like unbiased reporting, here's this mouse, it does this, it does that, it does these other things this is what people are people.
Speaker 2:People are fans, people are biased and people are also going to share their enthusiasm for a brand, a company. Uh, you know, and I mean and I think that's okay too.
Speaker 1:it's that weird middle ground. It's that weird middle ground where it's unclear and someone's trying to appear like, oh, I'm just like, it's the thing where someone's trying to appear like, oh, I'm just like. It's the thing where someone's trying to appear they're lying to you. They're trying to appear like it's genuine and it's unbiased. When it, even if the bias is just that their bank account got bigger, it's biased.
Speaker 2:But you just said that bias is okay.
Speaker 1:But when you're open about it, when you say I love Fender, one of the fender factory, this can be awesome, okay, cool. I don't really expect you to be that critical about them. That's not what I'm here for. If you love, you know hey, the sennheiser mic is great. Check it out. I love sennheiser. They're a great company. Here's a sennheiser mic. I'm probably gonna say pretty nice things also because this is the thing I chose to make. I chose to make a video about probably means I like it. That's very different than like I am only talking about this because it when it's hidden and it's unclear and it it does seem like you're a fan of something that you're not really a fan of right, and that that goes back to the uh what kat said earlier, where, uh, the companies and the sponsors are dictating the conversation.
Speaker 1:Yes, because yeah, there's the difference.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you would not have talked about it, whereas the Fender fan would have talked about it.
Speaker 1:like anyway, if I had a channel at Fender Guitars, and it was a couple years in and then I even actively reached out to Fender.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you showed up at the factory. I could make a video and be like. I asked Fender if I could go to the factory. They said yes. Honestly, everyone would be excited.
Speaker 1:Probably it's a victory for the whole community.
Speaker 2:Exactly, your win is our win. So what happened? Well, what happened is exactly that.
Speaker 1:It's somebody else dictating the thing.
Speaker 2:Right, that's what happened.
Speaker 1:Yeah, sorry.
Speaker 2:This is a point that I wanted to get out. Tell it.
Speaker 1:Go. There has been a string of things over the past couple of years of YouTube channels getting hacked and doing like weird crypto live streams. I don't know if you.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:It's a thing that happens and some channels have hundreds of thousands, millions of subscribers and it really could potentially ruin somebody's career, their life Like. It is very damaging when this happens Like a channel gets taken over All videos. Their life Like it is very damaging when this happens Like a channel gets taken over, all videos get deleted, and usually some scammers just run this weird crypto live stream until it gets taken down. The channel gets deleted by YouTube. The person may or may not ever get their channel back. There's a bunch of different ways that that can happen and it's a scary thing to talk about. One of the more common ways has something to do with downloading a PDF to your computer that has something in it that essentially, like then gains access to anything you're logged into on your browser. So if you have your YouTube dashboard open and then you have your email open and you click the PDF now, that you're logged into your YouTube dashboard.
Speaker 2:It has access to your YouTube dashboard, something like that.
Speaker 1:I don't quite know how all that stuff works, but it's something along those lines, and the way that people are getting to a lot of YouTube creators is they sound like a brand deal, maybe from a legitimate brand. Hey, I'm the, you know, the marketing manager for whatever company. We'd love to offer you this brand deal. Here's our contract download and check it, you know, open it and check it. What you think about it? And then the person clicks on it, which I mean.
Speaker 1:Part of that is a savviness of like. Never download anything from someone you're not sure of. And if you hear from a brand that you've never heard from before, even if it seems like a legit brand, someone from Shure reaches out but you're like, you've never talked to anyone from. Sure, sure, is a trustworthy company. You can, instead of downloading anything or applying to them, you can look up the person like, look them up on linkedin, like, do a google search and see if they, if that person with that email address or, even better yet, find that person in the like the company directory and email them yourself and say hey, I received this email, just want to make sure, make sure that this is um above board see, this is why I tell everyone if you want to reach out, reach out to me on instagram, because I'm not freaking downloading anything yeah, no.
Speaker 1:But what this showed me again, going back to, like, lots of channels that I thought not only were savvy or whatever, it was the number of companies that aren't trying to impersonate this, they're just shady. Whatever companies and the number of people who will just click yes, download on any brand deal that sent their way is insane. And that, to me, is like when you want to talk about companies getting in the driver's seat. When someone is open to essentially whoever wants to put money in the collection plate. I don't know like you're setting yourself up, for that is how things go down a bad road, because it's like I don't give a crap if we're talking about a mattress, if we're talking about a camera, if we're talking about a meal prep service, give me money and I'll be whatever you need me to be like.
Speaker 2:That's the level that a lot of people operate at I know, but it sucks because I I know they don't know any better.
Speaker 1:I feel like that person I mean well, again, it's all, it's all. Gray area, there's no black or white, because it's like if you run an audio channel, you get an email from sure, why wouldn't you open it? You know, um? But when you get an email from some weird company promising the best thing ever and just download our weird pdf, like why would you do?
Speaker 2:that sorry, that's I know, but it's hard. I just. I feel bad, though, with that, because it's like I always feel bad for the.
Speaker 1:You know it's the thing of like better one guilty person go free than 10 innocent people get locked up kind of situation. I know there's people who are just like trying their best and getting taken advantage of or finding themselves in weird situations. But I also know there I legitimately know there are plenty of people who have their like, their two sides, not just the like. Maybe you turn up your personality, like I'm talking more loudly now than I talk when we're just hanging out in the kitchen, maybe.
Speaker 1:Maybe I'm not no, maybe it's the same um, but you know, there's like when the camera's on you. You you're aware, the camera's on right um, but that difference you know, like doc, whoever else is in the chat that we've met in person, they're the same, basically, if you've seen them on youtube. You've met them in person there hasn't I think everyone we know in our circle that we would call our friends is that yeah, there are people, it's not we're not in a circle where it's not the same.
Speaker 2:It's not and they do a really good job on camera of making you think that it just it makes me uncomfortable because it's like I hate that that crap.
Speaker 1:So I'm not going to. I have zero empathy for that.
Speaker 2:If you want to do that though.
Speaker 1:If you want to do that and then you burn yourself because you've got yourself into a crappy deal and you've eroded the trust of your audience Eroded, I don't why am I going to feel sorry for you? Yeah, I'm mad at you because now my audience has lost trust, right?
Speaker 2:right right.
Speaker 1:So, no, I have zero sympathy for that person. But it also makes me sick when I see people do that because it's I don't know. It's the same feeling I get and this is a thing that happens as a dude, especially as a straight white guy. People other straight white guys will tell me things that are so horrific because because for some reason, they think we're in like this club and it is bad a lot. It's really bad, and it could be something like, say, me and a person are standing right here and there's a girl talking to us and it's like, oh hey, yeah, this everybody's friendly or whatever. And then they leave and this person will say the most disgusting, awful things about that person who is just right there. They would never say it to their face. They turn into an entirely different person. It's very scary and I feel very gross and disgusted when that happens and I want nothing to do with it.
Speaker 1:There are people who run their channels the same way. They're in front of the camera. Oh man, you guys, guys, we're just the community and we're all in it. You're, and you know what you are to them, you are just ad revenue, affiliate.
Speaker 1:Clinks, clinks clicks affiliate link clicks um, you are a sponsorship, you know.
Speaker 2:You're another number to crank up my sponsorship revenue I think the reason why this really gets under your skin it does Is because I think with YouTube, specifically with your journey, it was like such a pure magical, innocent thing where you were able to be yourself, accepted for who you are, which is something that know first so much did not happen in the real world, so much of your life you felt like you didn't belong you always felt like the odd one out and like you were doing something wrong.
Speaker 2:And then you started a youtube channel and there was all these other people who shared, who were just as nerdy and odd and weird as you. You think I'm nerdy and weird. I love that about you.
Speaker 1:Weird.
Speaker 2:I am too. But I think that's why you get so. I don't want people to clip this out and it's just Tom going off. But I think the reason is because this is something very special to me. I don't like seeing it abused. What?
Speaker 1:I consider abused. It is just a thing. It's the website, but it's a special thing. Yeah, you're right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, andre says the paid accommodation part is relevant for travel YouTubers, among other things, so it would be relevant for a video about a resort.
Speaker 1:We just watched a video from abroad, in Japan, speaking of Japan. Where he, you know, it was like 48 hours in Hiroshima. Things you can do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and he talked about a hotel. Yeah, we literally. I paused the video mid-video and I was like Chris, this whole trip was paid. He says it, he's super clear about it and I don't feel weird about it at all.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he's like Because.
Speaker 2:I want his perspective about these things. I want his production as he goes through these places. I don't feel weird about it.
Speaker 1:He's literally like the hotel. Let us check out the.
Speaker 2:The super mauler suite. I don't feel like, oh, look at this chump, yeah, I mean. So you know, the super baller sweet.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't feel like, oh, look at this chump like there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, so there's so obviously there's a way to do it there's a way to, and that's just.
Speaker 1:He's just super transparent and I'm cool with that.
Speaker 2:Everybody was cool with that but why wouldn't you be transparent? I don't know I don't know, I mean I think it gets. I I don't know. I really don't know. Maybe it's because, maybe it's because obviously the niche slash genre that we have the most exposure to is yours audio video yeah, I mean I'm sure these things happen, it's products. It's, you know, you're not makeup, which is like 20 for a lipstick. You're, you know, a thousand twelve hundred bucks for a camera.
Speaker 1:So I feel like every niche has a thing. But yeah, the camera thing and that's. But that's also like you're potentially convincing people to spend a lot of money on something I know and I know under false pret.
Speaker 2:This is why I feel weird talking about it, because it's like I feel like there's no care, there's no like sense of responsibility, of like.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:You know, the endorsement should come to me the same way that you would tell a friend about the new happy hour down the street.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because we do that. I mean that's, you know, some like, especially like, especially like. I'm thinking of, like peter lindgren and bronson from audio hotline, some of our real life youtuber friends. When we talk it is just a youtube video. It literally is. I mean check out this new thing I got bronson literally sent me his own custom-made lut pack the other day with a tutorial video about how to like use it.
Speaker 1:And I have talked to Peter so many times, whether it's in person or on like a FaceTime call, where he will talk about like oh, if you look at this camera, okay, it's so cool, because when I go like this and I push this button, this thing literally just becomes the YouTube video just for me. But it's genuine, like this is. It's so genuine and this is this is obviously what you would be doing when no one is watching, because I'm the only one here, and so then when you make a video and you talk about that, it's super genuine and I don't care, it could be something that was sent to you, it could be something you bought yourself, but the the genuine passion, enthusiasm and excitement is there okay, we have to catch up here.
Speaker 2:I'm sorry I'm trying to not let's see every time because gifts can absolutely cause preferential treatment towards certain customers or clients.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I know a lot of things even, uh yeah, when I was on the arts commission, it was like you couldn't receive a gift from someone for more like 25 bucks or whatever roger is here.
Speaker 2:Some creators were promoting FTX up until it went under and a lot of people lost money.
Speaker 1:I don't know what FTX is. I think it's like a coin of some kind.
Speaker 2:Oh, andre says also for YouTubers staying somewhere and just mentioning that place which might have paid their accommodation, even though the video might be about a camera or creative process or not related stuff. Well, bnh helped cover our travel costs for nab and we said it so many freaking times loud and proud. I mean I changed, we changed our lanyards, the default like nab went to the bnh. They didn't ask us to do that, but I was like this is cool, this is cool.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they did that they, they it was really cool and they they didn't cover every. They covered our flight and our hotel. We still had to pay for, you know, meals and dog boarding, which is just as expensive as human hotel, you know, and stuff like that. So it really reduced the cost. It took care of like two thirds of our whole travel costs, which made the trip possible. But it's like we didn't walk away with like a fatter bank account necessarily. We just had a slightly less less fat bank account because of it. But that was, that was a sponsorship. You would call that a sponsorship that enabled us to do a thing we couldn't have done otherwise, because otherwise it'd been like this is just too expensive, we can't go doc says I personally don't care if the video is paid or not.
Speaker 2:Every actor, athlete, musician you've ever seen commercials paid. This is big. This is a big deal being made over what's been normal marketing for business. Marketing business make your own decisions period. The reviews are for information only. You need to make your choices and do your research.
Speaker 1:If the product sucks, return it I mean always buy from somewhere that has a good. I mean I think.
Speaker 2:The difference, though, is that I feel like there is a I don't know cultural, societal understanding that this is expected for actors, athletes and musicians. The tricky part is YouTube, because the whole point of YouTube.
Speaker 1:is this normal person?
Speaker 2:It's just a person like you. It's a person like me. It's someone who's just a. You don't have like superpowers or you know an unlimited budget. You're just you're. You're just like the person who's watching this, and that's where it gets weird yeah, you're the viewers. I mean that could be like the that that should be the advantage.
Speaker 1:But then right, of course that is huge.
Speaker 2:Maybe that's why they don't check the boxes and it takes away from. You know that we were the same person, isn't?
Speaker 1:there a thing. I don't know if they still do this. I was never someone who went to these, but I heard at one point in time at least there were like girls who would work for alcohol companies and they would be in bars and they would like sit next to a guy and be like you know, chatting about me, like, oh, I'm drinking, you know sky vodka. Like, do you want? Do you want a sky vodka? Or like whatever, I don't know, is that a vodka? Yeah, okay, um, and then whatever drink, whatever brand it was, they would just be like, oh, this is what I drink, could you buy me another one here? Like, and they would just sort of like, try, they would just be like real life advertising for the company yeah, that's totally a.
Speaker 2:Thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like okay but I'm pretty sure I've been to a party where literally sky but I mean but, but that's kind of what it is. So someone sits down next to you at a bar and starts talking to you but they're wearing like a sky, no, no, no, I'm talking about there was.
Speaker 2:Oh, there's a thing where no would be like. I'm just interested in you and you're cute and you're having fun Like, hey, sky Vodka. No, that's weird, no.
Speaker 1:I'm not sure if it's like sorry, sky Vodka, I don't some other ground vodka, okay, floor vodka, but that's a different feeling of like. Oh, I thought we were having a conversation and you, like you, not only don't care about me, but you are trying to sell me on something, and that is different than like we've been playing Yakuza games a lot lately you go to the hostess club in Kamurocho in Japan and the characters in the game they're paying for a hostess to hang out with and they know that person is sitting in the booth with them because they are being paid.
Speaker 1:Yeah, whether or not you're having a conversation or whatever, it doesn't matter. It's very clear. This is only happening because the person is getting paid yeah so that's up front. That's an upfront thing that the insidious like you don't really know that I'm working for this company, but I'm gonna sell you on this thing is the ulterior motive.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, that's where it gets. Shady matthew mcconaughey cannot get me to buy lincoln.
Speaker 1:I don't own a pair of jordans uh, I have spent oh money.
Speaker 2:I've been on my own accord. Harvard doesn't equal inherently bad, but, like is said on tom's video, the victim mentality, people are loud and the echo chambers makes it seem worse than it is it's such a such a gray area issue, man well, who's the victim, though? Like who's, who is the victim in this case? Uh, roger says there's a difference watching a review video about a specific camera with a sponsored segment in the middle from Artlist or whatever, than the video being sponsored from that specific camera brand.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and there's nothing wrong with it being sponsored with the camera brand. Like I said, my Sennheiser. It's about a Sennheiser microphone sponsored by Sennheiser, but it's not a review. It's me telling you about a microphone that I really like and think is cool, and I'm excited about microphones and you know like it's how you do it.
Speaker 2:Uh, let's see, in that scenario there are people I trust looking at you, tom, and people I don't trust yeah, and you really have to calibrate your individual viewer things. What if they lied about fender paying for the trip? Would that offender you? I toured, sure, so you won't hear me bad mouthing them, but because they make solidish yeah, I mean, and that may.
Speaker 1:So you know who's been like prior to the sm7b and the mb7. You know who's been like preaching the the qualities of shore. Forever is doc yeah who's been using them since pre-youtube yeah if he goes to the shore factory and has an awesome time. Yeah, like that's obviously.
Speaker 2:Uh, let's see that hacking youtube scenario thing a case for the middle-class youtuber task force to work toward the youtube to make processes where smaller youtubers have someone to talk to yeah, I mean, there you go, right, right a case for the middle class youtuber having a group yeah, uh, let's see I'm kind of skipping through oh, here there's doc even saying I was a sure dealer before the internet existed there yeah, I have sure mike's older than tom and heather. There you go so you?
Speaker 1:you are biased towards, sure, but they've earned it right, like and there's nothing wrong with that. Exactly there's nothing wrong with that there's nothing wrong with like having brand loyalty to you know, to a thing that has served you well, and that this is funny. Most people will fall for the price of zamunda the prince hr.
Speaker 2:Fully understand you saying they don't know, but they are responsible to know and often don't. Ignorance is nine-tenths cliche. Who's they? What was I saying? They are responsible to know and often don't.
Speaker 1:I'm feeling like we're talking about viewers. I'm not sure they are responsible to know and often don't Saying they don't know. I don't know if it's the. I'm not sure if it's the viewer or the creator.
Speaker 2:Because we're like 15 minutes behind in our comments. A.
Speaker 1:Peavey, mic, andre Wow, that is a name I haven't heard in a long time.
Speaker 2:Let's see Good job.
Speaker 1:Hey, I'll take it that's an A yeah.
Speaker 2:Solid Tom's japanese is getting pretty good because we've been playing yakuza zero and it's all in japanese I forgot how to.
Speaker 1:Oh arigato, is that how you say? Thank you, microphone desk uh, let's see.
Speaker 2:I know I should make a video about it. Got it from the youth club. I started djing. Oh, this is the mic um on the travel channel. They don't mention the accommodations but it's disclosed in the credits.
Speaker 1:Same for yeah, I mean the, the, like the avengers movie will say promotional considerations, like provided by in the list, all the brands, but that's, you know, minute 19 of the end credits.
Speaker 2:So uh, you think kara and nate pay for their primo accommodations that they visit. It's more or less understood that us mere muggles will have to pay for that fancy underwater suite.
Speaker 1:I don't know who they are, but I mean the broad japan thing, like I don't. I honestly don't even know if he got to stay in the the fancy suite because there was no footage of them like moving things around. It was still in pristine condition the whole time. But obviously, like I know, that's not the suite we would stay in if we went to that hotel. But it's definitely like I know nothing about this place. If I want to go here, let's look up that hotel that had the cool views he talked about. I would do that. Oh oh, doc pops nice uh, hey, bailey hey let's see doc pops.
Speaker 1:I like not, not pop rocks, but rock pops as long as this is closed yeah, I mean just transparency people are pretty cool with if you're just I know, but I do think that there is a difference. If you're a creator, I feel like you have a lot more savvy than a viewer yeah, I mean yeah, which is why I feel like, if you're a creator, just be transparent with right because if the viewer doesn't have that savvy, then you're helping them figure it out. Ringer girls, that's what talks.
Speaker 2:Yes, oh yeah, you, you would know, of course I mean not that sounds weird because if you're like dj, back um tokyo, vice is a great show, so fun to see several locations for a trip last year no extra access, so yakuza yuck, no extra x on the coup.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yakuza yakuza, yakuza, I think I said yakuza no, you said it right, yakuza yakuza yakuza jacuzzi will.
Speaker 2:Years ago I was at a bar and a girl came up and started chatting about what I smoked. Turns out she was with camel, giving away free packs of their new stage.
Speaker 1:I got a free zippo out of it too.
Speaker 2:There you go, there you go um a meaning the youtubers who don't understand sponsorship right right, right right yeah, uh, bye, homesick mag. By the way, heather, the long sentence is being squished. Talk to tom. It's a setting in ecamm for line breaks in the comment text box oh, I must have that setting.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that was by default, I don't know. Yeah, because mine weren't doing actually ecamm, you are all here.
Speaker 2:How do I make this like? How do I fix this like?
Speaker 1:so the box isn't gets squishy squished, it's and it goes so it goes onto a separate line so the text wraps is is that it?
Speaker 2:HR's Yakuza, yeah, yeah, yakuza.
Speaker 1:I believe that they would have.
Speaker 2:Chris Pratt is a legend. I'm going in August, wish you guys could come. We're going next year for our 40th birthday.
Speaker 1:Birthdays, yeah.
Speaker 2:And five year anniversary. Yeah, it works out right. Yeah, okay, cool. Hey, we caught up. Yeah, we caught up. I'm just gonna wait here until I get the answer about the ecamm comment thing because I don't know how to do it.
Speaker 1:Let's poke around in it. If we pop up a comment, I'm gonna pop up doc's ringer girl comment here no, you need a long one but couldn't we? Um sorry, now I'm doing a thing here we have transition border, border width no, I think it's in the setting settings well, because I looked in the setting settings and I didn't see it. But it must be because there's nothing there. So if we go to our ecam settings sorry, you guys can't see this right now um, and we go to general wait, hold on.
Speaker 2:Let me make sure that doc is gonna be like it's here, we're just squinting at the prompter now because here's the automatically hide. Comment overlays the stream oh, that is the biggest blep in the freaking world. Oh my god, right now, no you is he still got it?
Speaker 1:it's still going it's still active, active blep situation. All right you do know, there's a famous ecamm employee here I'll have to get it finley what do you think, buddy finley, finley, you having fun here I'm going to go for. There it is.
Speaker 2:Look at that blep. Do we see this right now? Oh my goodness, it just sits there. You're going to make everyone sick. I'm going to change that.
Speaker 1:Finley, you hear that You're going to make everyone sick. I'll drag the comment box from the side In text.
Speaker 2:I wish you guys could see.
Speaker 1:Okay, oh wait, I see a thing here. Oh Well, here, let's put this one up. Oh see, now that one.
Speaker 2:Oh wait, it's this little handle here. Handle here okay, but just like not all the way.
Speaker 1:Just yeah, like this yeah, and now, if we click on anybody's, they are all staying the same size.
Speaker 2:Well, that's like huge though.
Speaker 1:Well, that would be this right to resize it then oh, and then yeah and, and, then we can pop it in the center.
Speaker 2:No, but make it here.
Speaker 1:Well, it's your stream, you do whatever you want. Yeah, it's your channel, it's our stream. It's your channel and your settings.
Speaker 2:Where'd it go, boom?
Speaker 1:That's the yeah, that's the one that will.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like Tate it. How's that?
Speaker 1:There we go.
Speaker 2:Are we good? Is that centered, I think?
Speaker 1:that's good, that's good. And now let's try clicking on another long one.
Speaker 2:Boom yeah.
Speaker 1:I think they're all the same. I don't find a long comment yeah.
Speaker 2:Okay, it's working. Yeah, we did it.
Speaker 1:Oh my God that has been bugging me so long. Cool, cool, all right, appreciate it. Now we're ready to go. Now we're ready to clear the table that was fun.
Speaker 2:The blep is still out.
Speaker 1:By the way, the blep is still out, dry and crusty at this point all right.
Speaker 2:Well, that was a fun discussion. Thanks for tuning in everyone yeah, all right.
Speaker 1:Well, thanks for hanging out with us. Uh hope you have a safe, happy, healthy, fun rest of your week and weekend and we will see you next time bye, have a good weekend the butt disappeared.