The Couple's Table

The Future of Content [076]

• Heather & Tom • Season 1 • Episode 76

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Where is the world of online content headed in 2022 and beyond? Let's talk about it!

🟣 JOIN OUR COMMUNITY!
JUST CREATE MORE!

🟣 CONNECT WITH HEATHER —
My Vlog Channel: http://www.youtube.com/heatherjustcreate
My Tutorial Channel: http://www.youtube.com/heatherramirez
Instagram: http://www.instagram.com/heatherjustc...
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/hetjustcreate
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/heatherjustcr...
Website: http://www.heatherjustcreate.com

🟣 CONNECT WITH TOM —
YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/tombuck 
Instagram: @sodarntom

🟣 CONNECT WITH HEATHER —
My Vlog Channel: http://www.youtube.com/heatherjustcreate
My Tutorial Channel: http://www.youtube.com/heatherramirez
My Gaming Channel: http://www.youtube.com/heatherjustplay
Instagram: http://www.instagram.com/heatherjustcreate
Website: http://www.heatherjustcreate.com

🟣 CONNECT WITH TOM —
YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/tombuck
Instagram: http://www.instagram.com/sodarntom

SPEAKER_00

Hello and welcome. My name is Tom.

SPEAKER_01

And I'm Heather.

SPEAKER_00

And you are sitting at the Couples Table.

SPEAKER_01

Couples Table is a live stream podcast here on this channel. Join us for better or worse.

SPEAKER_00

For richer or poor.

SPEAKER_01

In sickness and in health.

SPEAKER_00

As long as we both shall live.

unknown

Ta-da.

SPEAKER_00

That was so easy. I hope everything's working okay.

SPEAKER_01

You're so excited. This is so easy.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, so uh today it's all about the future.

SPEAKER_01

The future.

SPEAKER_00

I don't know. I was trying to think.

SPEAKER_01

Everyone's gonna think we froze.

SPEAKER_00

Sorry. I had so many thoughts running through my head at once that nothing happened. Oh goodness. Uh but anyway, I'm excited about this. I'm also hoping something happens during this specific stream.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, if you were in the pre-show with us over at the Just Create More community.

SPEAKER_00

We have a special camera angle today. Let me uh get there in a second. I'm gonna wait for it to load. It is our front door as we wait for a special delivery. So um yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Hopefully it comes. We don't know if it will.

SPEAKER_00

I sure hope so. Keep monitoring. Don't worry, I'll keep you on the phone.

SPEAKER_01

It's like the one time we actually want the deliveries to come during a live stream.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I know.

SPEAKER_01

Usually we're like, oh, hopefully it doesn't interrupt the meeting.

SPEAKER_00

Anyway, um, it's great to see everybody here. Thank you for um for hanging out with us. I did want to bring up, I talked to some of you, or you know, we looked at some of the comments during the the countdown, but Divergent Design Studios asking, Heather, where did you get your hoodie?

SPEAKER_01

It's from Fresh Hoods. Not sponsored. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Uh but it is it's so bright, it's really cool. Yeah, it looks great on camera.

SPEAKER_01

But they have like other they have sweaters and stuff.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, all kinds of like really cool patterns and stuff. I really like them. Uh we got Gary. What's up, Gary? Hello, we've got Jackie the hot tub lady, we've got Josh Scott, we've got Curiosity Network Podcast, we've got Rahul, we've got Drew, we've got Marta Sammy. Oh, you already answered the question. And Curiosity Network Podcast says usually listen to the pre-recorded thing on Spotify. This is my first time watching it live. So excited. Nice re-listen to the part that we talked about you in. Um, Patrick said picture in picture with the front door. Actually, you are a smart, smart man, Mr. Boberg.

SPEAKER_01

But then it doesn't stay, it's not like you only get 30 seconds on the.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, our cameras are are goofy, but oh, hello. Sorry.

SPEAKER_01

I'm I'm not I don't mean to But we don't know if it's actually going to arrive.

SPEAKER_00

We got the little pip right here. And we'll put the pip below the comments. Wait, did did we can put the comments over here. The magic of Ecamm, which if you want to know more about Ecamm Live, check out my video from today that's all about Ecamm versus OBS. Anyway.

SPEAKER_01

Um Alright, Tom.

SPEAKER_00

Yes, so talking about the future of content, this is a discussion that we started talking about in November. Yeah. And I I had some questions and some thoughts and stuff, and then I've been sort of saving them for just whenever they popped up in a random discussion. Uh, but I'm curious what are we talking about when we're talking about like the future?

SPEAKER_01

Well, I feel like there's there's a lot changing. Do you feel that or is that just me? Because you're a lot more tapped in.

SPEAKER_00

I'm really hip and with it in the no.

SPEAKER_01

Well, I'm tapped in with like not content creators. It's well, that's not true. I guess the the stuff that I see is a lot of like people who are talking about content creators. But you like the first thing he checks every morning is YouTube. And he's a YouTube creator. So I feel like you know, I guess we're taught in in both ways. But I feel like there's I feel like there's a shift.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. So here's a thing that I I learned this when I was teaching, and it's when there's a group of people, you can like feel I don't know, I like vibes is the word that comes to mind, but it also might be like the zeitgeist or whatever, like the overall, what's in in the overall thing. And it's crazy because you know, sometimes I could just feel I'd have a class of 40, 45 students, and uh, you know, obviously not all of them feel the exact way all the time, but you can just kind of tell when it's like this group as a whole is really into this idea, or they're really tired of this, or they need a break, or they need to be pushed harder. Like you can just sort of sort of feel it, it's a weird thing. And the same thing is true on YouTube, like you it's not even just trends, like trends are related to it, I think, because a trend is the result of a bunch of people you know feeling away about something. But what really hits it is like I think of the summer of 2018 when it was just letterbox slow motion b-roll.

SPEAKER_01

Well, I think of 2020, 2021, which is just live streams and video podcasts.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. I mean, all the and and it's not that everyone's doing it because there's a trend, but it's like there's an excitement in 2018. It was like, I want to learn how to film in slow motion. In 2020, 2021, it was like, let's level up our live streaming game, like let's figure out this, let's be guests and do this kind of stuff. And then the thing about those is sometimes you feel that shift.

SPEAKER_01

Like you feel like I feel the shift, but I don't know what it means yet.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Like before, I I was like, oh yeah, you know, I could easily identify. I don't know if that's because I've been taking a break from social media and the internet. I don't know that I know.

SPEAKER_00

I need to set my phone to not auto-power off. I don't know that I know what it means either, but I have a couple sort of interesting thoughts um that have popped up. Sorry, I'm just trying to change this, which is very unnecessary. But um the the thoughts I had and the questions I had kind of relate to how the YouTube platform handles it when creators are going through these sort of like transitory periods.

SPEAKER_01

Oh.

SPEAKER_00

And I for better or worse. And I'm just, I have like I have a thought and I have an idea, but my feeling is that it sounds like a great idea to me, but I genuinely think there's some blind spots in my thinking, and so I wanted to share it with you and with other people so that instead of me just thinking like this would be a good idea, I can understand like I re- I know that it's it hasn't happened yet for a reason, and I need to know what that is.

SPEAKER_01

Can I share something before that?

SPEAKER_00

Yes, oh yeah, yeah, that's I'm just saying that's what my like okay.

SPEAKER_01

So here's um something I feel, but I don't know what it means, nor do I have tangible data to really prove it.

SPEAKER_00

This is like before we started dating, how we felt about it.

SPEAKER_01

Okay, so here here, let me try to explain this. Uh so pandemic, right?

SPEAKER_00

Heard of it?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, then everyone jumps online. Um there is a almost like a renaissance, I feel like, of oh, I can create something. And I feel like more than any other time of the internet, we see a bunch of people figure out that they have a story worth sharing and that they have a voice. And they're figuring that out. Prior to that, I think a lot of the ways that people would use the internet and social media is to connect with people they already know. They already know in real life. I think the majority of internet users were still doing that. And then in 2020 that shifted because, you know, just the way that the platforms are evolving, and I think this is where I'm getting to now, is that all of the platforms, I can confidently say now, all of the platforms, the major players at least, Instagram, YouTube, you know, YouTube's been doing this since day one. But Instagram and Twitter and TikTok are all optimized for you to connect with people that you have you will never meet in real life. And I think that that is true more than ever. I think that if you were to scroll on Instagram, you're gonna see most of the content you see is gonna be from someone that you don't necessarily personally know. So whether that's a brand, whether that's an ad or a celebrity, or you know, a suggested profile, or you know, yeah, like, oh, we saw that you like this account, so here's a post by this other account.

SPEAKER_02

Right.

SPEAKER_01

Um and I don't really know what that means, but I feel like that's a major, major shift. Like, yeah, you know, I really think that changes everything.

SPEAKER_00

I feel like a lot of people who had been doing whatever, YouTube content online for a while kind of knew like that's how we met.

SPEAKER_02

Like we've been excited about that.

SPEAKER_00

But it was a lot more niche that idea. And it's almost like online dating back in like 2002 and like a weird. You probably don't want to tell people about that. Yeah. Whereas now it's like you met someone in person that you didn't know, like that's so dangerous. So um, I feel like now that kind of was the thing that like broke it open and made it way more accessible and mainstream and kind of shared that excitement with a way bigger group of people who then got really excited about it.

SPEAKER_01

That's a very big deal. Like, I think the fact that it is normal to connect with people that you haven't personally met in real life, that that's a huge that's never happened ever in human history.

SPEAKER_00

That that has been Which is so great because so many think of how many conflicts throughout human history have arisen only because you're from over there and we're from over here, and it's weird because we don't know what you do over there, and now it's like it it's meaningless. Like it doesn't matter that you where you are, it's like we can still all sort of I don't know, I think that's very, very cool.

SPEAKER_01

So I don't really know what that means for content because I I don't I don't notice a pattern with myself. Like usually I can see okay, I you know, I'm I'm watching a lot of video podcasts. Like I I can't say that now um but I do think that there is a huge push overall for short form content, and by short form I mean like you know, five, ten seconds. Yeah, and it's just I don't know how I feel about that.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, that that personally that I don't know. I think that that my just general opinion is I think that that's not gonna go away. It's toothpaste that cannot go back in the tube, but I think it's like it's this big crazy new thing right now. It's super accessible because the idea of making a 20-second thing with your phone versus a 15-minute edited YouTube video, like, you know, it's way less intimidating to pick up your phone and just do something like that. Um, but I also think like the way I feel is like that excitement of hey, live streaming, video podcasts, all that kind of stuff. I feel like that is starting to wane a little bit.

SPEAKER_01

I get that vibe too.

SPEAKER_00

And I feel like a lot of things are starting to just like it's not people are getting tired of it, people are looking for like what's next, or how, you know, they're kind of reaching the next level, don't know where to go. I don't know what the next thing is. Like, I don't see that like this is where the new trend is. Um, but I feel like there is just sort of that growing group shift in, hey, we're ready for something else, but I don't know what it is. And that's interesting to me because I've talked so many times on here about some of the YouTube creators that I am like that I admire the most and I'm interested the most are people like Marquez Brownlee or I just need people who've been around for over a decade at this point, and they're they've been themselves the whole time, but they have managed to evolve their content in a way that's stay relevant. Yeah, and it's not even just staying relevant, staying on top of trends, but they're like they're still enjoying it. And that to me is fascinating because you clearly have to do that every couple of years in this world. And I'm trying to like, you know, it's so easy to look back and go like, oh well, things shifted from this to this, and then everybody shifted, but when you're in the middle of that, it's not clear, you know.

SPEAKER_01

So here's like another, I don't know, another observation I have is a lot of the people that I follow that talk about the creator economy, their prediction for the next thing is community. Um we were you know, we've been talking about community for it's a word that we've talked about for a very long time now. So it's not like a new thing.

SPEAKER_00

We did it before it was cool.

SPEAKER_01

But I think I think I think what it is is that creators are realizing that if they do not build their own community off of a platform that is allowing you to use it for free, you are putting yourself at risk, right? So if you are if the only place that you're that you can communicate with your people is YouTube, and then YouTube deletes your channel, you're screwed, right? Um so that prediction is build your online audience, create your online brand, create your content, but use that as the gateway to your home base, which is you know, some kind of community, a discord server, uh, you know, an online course or or some place where um you are not behind a gatekeeper of like, you know, Instagram decides when your posts get shown to your people or Facebook or whoever. Um and I I feel that that that is true. What worries me is I can see it getting old very, very fast. Whereas short form vertical content, I think that's here to stay. As much as I don't like it, um, it's very effective. It is wildly entertaining. It's so much easier to get certain types of information across. Oh my gosh, like you can learn tips about cooking.

SPEAKER_00

You know, you can learn a lot more without having to have a like hey guys, welcome to my video. Today we're gonna talk about cooking tips, but before that, just a few updates and then sponsored by HelloFresh, etc.

SPEAKER_01

And then if you didn't know three, you know, the reason why I haven't been posting, blah blah blah, and you're like watching the video two years later, and it's like this is not even relevant to me. Yeah. So like one minute on YouTube. As we head into 2017, I just really want to like so so short form vertical, here to stay. Uh online communities, I think I want to believe that it is here to stay because I think that's very empowering for creators since that is a solid way to build and scale a business because you have ownership, 100% ownership over your book of business and you have direct content with contact with your people. Um, I just feel like as a digital citizen, how many communities are you gonna sign up for?

SPEAKER_00

You know, it is it's hard. That's why I think Discord is really effective. Not perfect, but it's like you know, you have your Discord account, you can sign up for multiple servers and it's the one account, and then you just go to Discord and you can just easily go through all your servers. Um, that's really effective. Like that's that's pretty cool. And it's it's free and people are already on it, so it's like that's interesting though, because it's not it's not content.

SPEAKER_01

So I don't, you know, in terms of the future of content.

SPEAKER_00

Well, but it's a way of keeping in touch because YouTube and this isn't even a criticism, it it's not a great place for two-way dialogue between like the you know, you are the the creator who put out the stuff and the people comment on it, you can reply back, but it's it's not a discussion place or anything for stuff like that. And so that's why you think you've seen Discord channels pop up as part of what so many people are doing. Um, and it and it it just now like it's so easy to get people to do, but it's also not perfect because if you have a large Discord server, which like I have a few of them, or not I don't I don't have them, I'm in a few larger Discord servers, and it's almost overwhelming. I like it when I actually need a question or have a question because I can go and I'm gonna get a response immediately. But when I just want to go like hang out and browse stuff, like gosh, if I haven't checked this in three days, I don't even know where to begin. Uh speaking of checking things, let's check in with the comments. Kevin said, couldn't agree more. He connected with more and more people and more deeply via various internet platforms since the pandemic lockdown in March of 2020. Indie Creator Hub said, I agree, Heather looks like short form is gonna be the majority of content. I don't know about the major well, actually, probably if you're just looking at pure numbers, like how many short form videos versus how many long form videos, like volume. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Like you know, in terms of you know, terabytes of data do you want to do that?

SPEAKER_00

Not no in terms of files. Like for every one 10-minute video, there are X number of short form videos, but not necessarily volume or that, but in terms of what is being created more, probably. Oh no, not the metaverse.

SPEAKER_01

So I shouldn't say I'm working on a quick short.

SPEAKER_00

No, I'm I'm not saying it's uh that's actually something that's on my list right here. CT topics, shorts. Um because that that is something that when we're when we're done checking in with comments, I kind of want to talk about shorts a little bit. And pants too. Uh Philip, you're here. I don't know if you saw, but you make a cameo in today's video because I was using eCamm and it just randomly like one of your comments was still loaded in eCamm while I was screen recording, so you popped up there. Uh, did you notice that the YT homepage auto plays videos now if you hover over them? Yes.

SPEAKER_01

Which is I had that for a while.

SPEAKER_00

It's been like it's weird how like features come and go.

SPEAKER_01

I had that for a while because I when I do screen shares, I I get annoyed because I'm trying to point to a video and then it starts playing. Like, what the heck?

SPEAKER_00

Are you are you modding people?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. I don't know if you can make people wrenches on there, but can you add? Oh, you can. Wow, YouTube mobile app.

SPEAKER_01

I just gave you a wrench, Kevin.

SPEAKER_00

Uh Philip said to me it's crucial because I won't click on a video if it's too short, but I'll watch short videos on Instagram because they just autoplay. Oh, I it's it's like I'm not gonna choose it, but if it's in front of me.

SPEAKER_01

Because it's like not only am I scrolling this way, but the videos are playing this way, and I'm like, I can't.

SPEAKER_00

Peter said the world has changed. We don't even have family photos, just personalized NFTs. Give your mom an NFT for Mother's Day. That's what she always wanted. Ash said, I always prefer full-length video shorts, bother me to watch. Yes, I'm making one. It's worth experimenting with, I think. Um, I'll kind of talk about that in a second. Speaking of, actually, Leo is a master of like, you know, Instagram stories, reels, that kind of stuff, short form content. And in a way that like You do it well. Because he he does like you know, I'm gonna work on like a photo shoot for something. So here's behind the scenes stuff, here's the setup, here's the process, here's the finished result. And it's instead of being a whole video, which could be a 10-minute video about that, it's a bunch of short form content and then the final thing, but it's all separate things, and it's like really, really fun. So, you know, it's uh it it works. Uh Divergent Design Studios, the trend towards community is terrific, but I think creators, leaders of those communities have to be really serious about community building. I feel seen here.

unknown

Agreed, agreed, agreed.

SPEAKER_00

Because we're co-creating content. Members are offering workshops. Oh, in your community, members are offering workshops, you have community blog, yeah. And that's what you that's what you need for a community to really be successful. It can't be you as the person who started it pushing it forward, but it has to be created in a way where everyone takes ownership of it, and now it's it's a place, it's a destination for them, right? Yeah, but at least I'd watch short Instagram, short videos on Instagram, YouTube Shorts by Tom Buck, uh, when his cameraman is a loose canon. That was one of my animated ones. But yeah, so YouTube Shorts.

SPEAKER_02

Okay.

SPEAKER_00

Um, I've been playing around with them a little bit. I did a couple, they're the first things that I've ever like. I'm just gonna film this vertically with my phone and put it up there. Um, I know you can do shorts, you can film with regular cameras and make them all polished and stuff, but I feel like in the stuff I've been seeing about short form vertical content, a lot of it that people connect with the most is the kind of rougher, like there's just something about it being shot on a phone.

SPEAKER_01

And the way it's like, I think that you would be doing it wrong.

SPEAKER_00

I kind of feel like that too. Like it's not what it I don't want to say it's not what it's for. But it seems like what people connect with is that sort of like you can watch a full video to get the polished thing, but here is almost like a story. You know, here's just a quick the audio's not great, the whatever. Um, but the cool thing about shorts, there's a couple things that have changed since I did, I've done like four or five of them total, so not that many. When I did my first ones, I hated it because they they went into the analytics of your radio, they were counted as like videos. Being published on your channel and it just screwed up everything. I was like, I'm never doing this again because that for weeks and weeks and weeks, like 10 weeks, then you have shorts just clogging stuff up. YouTube fixed that. And now shorts are their own like top 10 analytics. They don't necessarily. I guess if you had an under-minute long video that was horizontal, it would go into your regular videos. But if it's a short vertical video, then it goes into the shorts analytics. So it doesn't mess up your analytics as much, which makes me feel more comfortable experimenting with them. The thing that I have been figuring out is whether or not to publish them to subscribers. Because I think I think it might have been Peter even said I did a short and he was like, Oh, so glad to see the regular video the next day because I thought the short was like what we were getting this week. Um and you know, if you do a bunch of shorts, I would hate for it to be like people are super annoyed because your channel is just shorts. But you can, when you publish them, you can uncheck the published to subscribers. And I've been kind of experimenting just on the short shelf. Yeah. I have noticed zero difference after several days. Um initially there's a huge difference. If you don't publish it and you do the thing, nobody watches it. But say like four or five days later, yeah, they've been exactly the same.

SPEAKER_01

Interesting. So well then that tells me to not share it.

SPEAKER_00

To your subscribers?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, because if it's exactly the same anyway, then might as well get in front of new people.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, well, so yeah. If if your audience is someone who's not expecting shorts, if your audience is there for your shorts, then you gotta publ, you know, let them know they're there.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Um however, so the reason I started playing with shorts recently is because I thought they would be a great way. I'm hearing something.

SPEAKER_01

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_00

To share, to share uh little quick things. Like I did one about the microphone pop filters, those windscreens, the colored ones. I did one about like how to clean up your Final Cut Pro library. These things that are really helpful, or you know, stuff that people ask all the time, but wouldn't be worth a whole video. Um and I maybe they could be included in another video, but then you have to watch another 10-minute video, like you know, and I can just share this info right here. And I think that's really, really cool. At least for me, if someone could watch a short, and I've been trying to keep them under 20 seconds, not just a minute, but like really, really, really short. And people can get you wear short shorts, and people can get something out of that that quickly. I think that's really, really valuable. Um, now, as far as getting in front of other people, yes, the thing that pushed me to do shorts was that there's a couple people I know like via YouTube and a couple people I watch via YouTube who started experimenting with them. And it's crazy because I've seen the their shorts, I was saying I've seen their shorts take off, but that's uh like they've done well. Okay, it's hundreds of thousands, millions of views. I've seen some channels pivot to like now we're the shorts channel. Which I don't like that because I'm like, I didn't that's not what I wanted from you originally. I like I like your long stories, I don't just want shorts.

SPEAKER_01

Okay.

SPEAKER_00

Um and so that was a cool thing. I was like, wow, like people who normally do really long videos, like a lot of channels I watch where they produce a 45-minute video, it takes them a month to make a video, and now they can do something super quick, and like you can get little updates from them. It's a really cool outlet where they don't have to do that whole process to share something, and it was getting seen by people, and I thought that was cool. But one of them specifically was doing exceptionally well and was like, Oh, I'm never doing another short again because it brought in, yeah, it got seen by millions of people, and then I had to deal with millions of people flooding my channel who have no idea what my channel is actually about, who I am. They're like rude and awful and mean, and it was like it's not necessarily yes, all the wrong people, and they're like, I'm I might even just delete all these. Like, and that kind of gave me pause of like, oh, okay, that's a very good thing to think of too. So it's interesting that at least in the world of YouTube, uh, shorts, like that idea of, well, if you want to do shorts, you need to start an entirely new channel just for shorts. I don't think that's the case anymore because they are separate, which is awesome. But I also think that, like, yeah, you are bringing a different audience, an audience who is drawn to short form content to your channel. And if most of your channel's not short form content, like that could not work very well, right?

SPEAKER_01

So Hassan says, I think MKBHD mentioned that they might be creating a completely separate channel for shorts. That's it.

SPEAKER_00

I saw that too. He also said that he thought TikTok was gonna disappear soon. Like he's like, even though they're making TikToks, he was like, I don't think that has like staying power.

SPEAKER_01

Well, because okay, so I think TikTok does not have staying power for so many reasons because their their freaking business model is replicatable, like everyone is doing it now, so you have nothing that keeps you apart. Plus, you don't have any sense of community because people don't know the TikTokers that they follow. Like there's not that same sense of like I'm subscribed to this channel, I've watched several videos, like they don't have that same affinity. So yeah, I don't think that I think TikTok should be worried if they don't go to the colour.

SPEAKER_00

The clock is ticking on TikTok.

SPEAKER_01

Uh but like Hassan said, I think that I wasn't sure. Like when people would ask me, Oh, should I start a completely different channel? I think there I would say yes, especially if you plan to do a lot of different things.

SPEAKER_00

If you do plan to do a lot, I think it could be great.

SPEAKER_01

And the reason is because one of the strengths of YouTube that Instagram doesn't have um, because okay, I think Instagram is better suited for short form vertical compared to YouTube. Like Instagram has Instagram has got it right. They have a separate um tab for it, their search is awesome. Uh people can easily share reels into their stories, you can tag people, like it's they've they've got it down better than TikTok or anyone else, in my opinion. Uh YouTube is figuring out, they're making progress. The the only thing that Instagram does not have down is being able to sort and curate your content. So they do have this thing where you can create guides, but I think that's a a feature that's only available to people who, you know, have some kind of threshold that they've met. But otherwise, like if I wanted to go to Tom's channel and be like, oh, I remember that short or that reel that I saw like six months ago, I'm never gonna find it unless I literally go through every single one. Whereas if you are on YouTube, bam, you've got Clay List, you've got homepage, you know, I can search within the channel. Exactly. Like that's what Instagram is missing. So in that case, if you're creating a separate channel just for your shorts, um, you'd be able to really curate your content where if someone new discovers you you can put some like thought behind what they should watch next.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, that's that's I mean that's the strength of YouTube is the library. Yeah, that's no other platform has it that way. Um, Peter says TikTok won't worry for a while. A few weeks ago they managed first time in the world to get more visits in 24. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Yes, this is true. They did.

SPEAKER_00

And I mean like that, you can't you can't argue with like the power and the popularity of TikTok, and also that means the impression that it's making on, especially like the generation that's mainly using it. I know like you know, everybody's on there, but it's primarily like a Gen Z thing, and that's a big part of their lives. It's you know, so it could disappear. Like MySpace was a part of our generation's thing, and it disappeared.

SPEAKER_01

Yes, but see, that's the thing, like it it is, but if that's the only reason, then as soon as the next thing comes, like you know, it'll be the whole thing where like only the olds are on Facebook now, you know.

SPEAKER_00

Um, yeah, so I think I it yeah, but so it's it's gonna be like only that guy.

SPEAKER_01

Only the olds are on they're on it. They're on it.

SPEAKER_00

Mods. Yeah. Did you go through the whole thing? I didn't go through the whole thing, um, but I brought up a few a few things. Kevin said I think the short form content situation and the way you view it has to do with when you start creating. New creators more inclined to be short form because that's what they see. Yeah. Um and Leo's trying now a new YouTube video where he's doing a detail behind the scenes. So it's cool to experiment with all the different different stuff and and see what's up. The pip is gone because it there's it's there's nothing. It would just be our empty porch for a while. Um so yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Wait. Um I saw someone who had millions of TikTok try YouTube and didn't gain any traction until he started doing shorts. Yeah, it's interesting.

SPEAKER_00

Right, because the audience for that person is uh BuckBit! Buckbit. There we go.

unknown

I love it.

SPEAKER_01

We saw it happen to Snapchat. See, the thing is though, Snapchat is still a thing. So, you know, I wouldn't call them in the top five, but I think if you went to the actual dude right now.

SPEAKER_00

Snapchat was what my high school students used to like. They still use the WhatsApp.

SPEAKER_01

It's their direct messaging app.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, that's what they use it for.

SPEAKER_01

I just opened the app store. The featured freaking app. It's Snapchat. This is the app store. Bam. The first thing right there is Snapchat. And if you go to top apps, top apps, I'm pretty sure Snapchat is still must-have apps. Top free apps.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, it's not in the top 10 though.

SPEAKER_01

It's not in the top 10 anymore. But it's still a top app.

SPEAKER_00

Top app.

SPEAKER_01

Oh, it is number 10.

SPEAKER_00

That's funny. Uh Josh says, even never enjoyed vertical videos, never install TikTok. Buck bits needs to be a thing. Yeah, it's in like most things, it comes down to knowing your audience and that kind of stuff. What I'm happy with is that YouTube doesn't seem to be punishing people for playing with shorts. Like they kind of I don't want to say they were, but like the platform was. Because that's the thing, like all the talk you hear about like all the YouTube algorithm or algorithms is even the people who make them like don't have like full control over them or know how they work or know how this is going to affect this or the other thing. And so it's not that even they necessarily wanted to punish someone for doing it, but it's just sort of analytically, data-wise, or whatever shorts were driving down your your thing. Because if you're, you know, say that you you put out a an eight-minute YouTube video that people watch 50% of is your average view duration. So they're watching four minutes of that. And then you put out a 45-second short that every single person who watches it watches all 45 seconds of it. So it's 100% view duration. Your view, your your analytics would still tank you because your average view duration is going down, even though that 45 seconds they can't watch more than that because it doesn't exist. It's like accounting for those kinds of things, I think YouTube has done, and it seems like you know, it's a little safer to play with them on your channel now, which is good.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I think Snapchat is, yeah, I think it's still a thing. It's more of like a WhatsApp. No one talks about WhatsApp, but people, you know, it's like one of the biggest apps in the world.

SPEAKER_00

It's like the it's like that's like talking about your male app.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it's just like people use it just for a function, but in terms of like building an audience, I don't think that's a thing as much.

SPEAKER_00

Um, Bailey, here we go. From the uh he's in the thick of it. I'm out of the loop now because I'm not in the classroom anymore. But he said, random people in my class just doing weird dances and then laughing and distracting me from completing my work. Yeah, that was what I remember for my students to like you know, lean the phone precariously up on a ledge and then like giggle for a while, and then I guess they made a TikTok. It's like I'm so old.

SPEAKER_01

Wait, so did you ask me the question?

SPEAKER_00

No.

SPEAKER_01

Oh.

SPEAKER_00

Uh so here's what I here's what I had in mind to talk about, actually. Um, and it started with talking about those creators who've been around for a long time. This is the timeline. See ya. Uh, and and being able to transition. Uh, Sarah Dici's the one that we've talked about for a while. She's been around for a long time. And what I think is so interesting about her is she's in a way her channel kind of reminds me of you because she's very transparent and she's gone through different like eras, phases on her channel. And I feel like, especially in the last couple years, you've seen her really like become her own thing, which has been super cool. Um, I feel like in the past you could see her sort of like feeling the pressure to do one thing, pressure to do another, take on a certain style, do whatever, and now it's like very much her own thing, which is really, really cool. And so she seems like she's been having a lot. I talk like like we know each other. From what I've seen on the outside, it seems like she's been having a lot more fun. Yeah. She wanted to do Vlogmas in December.

SPEAKER_02

Okay.

SPEAKER_00

So she did a bunch of videos, and at the end she posted a thing where she's like, no, I'm done. Like, I can't do this because it's killing my channel entirely. Like, she didn't want to be one of those. She specifically talked about like, I know these videos aren't gonna perform well compared to my other videos, but I wanted to do it for fun, like a creative thing. Um, but it was like it was killing the channel way too much that she was like, I have to just stop this, so I'm not gonna do it anymore.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Um, and that bummed me out because her daily things were really fun, and like there was some really cool stuff in there, and she was having a lot of fun, and it was like so and she talks in that video about like feeling as though once you kind of become the thing on YouTube, it's not just the audience, but it's the platform itself keeping you there. And then they'll even throw out new things. Here's shorts, here's live streaming, here's this, and the other thing, but like God forbid you try that. It's like, no, get back to do you don't you don't step out of your like lane over here. Um, and I was like, ah, and so what I was thinking, and this was my idea, that I think would be great, but I feel like there's a flaw that I'm not seeing in it. And okay, talking about TikTok. If if I created a TikTok account today and posted a TikTok, from what I know of the platform, I would have just as much ability to reach people as somebody who's been there from day one and has millions of followers or whatever. Like it really looks at each thing, each uploaded video as its independent thing and tries to give that to the person. I think YouTube does something similar. Like it knows what people might like, but if you're a new YouTuber and you just happen to make a video that is the thing people want to see, you can show up on search results, you can show up on recommended, you can show up there. It doesn't really matter that your channel's new or old, right? I mean, obviously, like if you have a million subscribers and you make anything, more people are gonna see it because by default it's being shown to a lot of audience.

SPEAKER_01

If your point is that I haven't made my point yet. If if you're saying that someone who has just started a new channel comes out with a really good, you know, effective video, it doesn't mean that their video can't be served because it's a new channel.

SPEAKER_00

Right.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. So it's sort of equal in a way.

SPEAKER_01

With TikTok though, and this isn't this is just me, I can't prove this, but I think that there's a devious, like this is a good thing.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, they 100% inflate your numbers if they're new to get you addicted.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, that that's I think that's different than YouTube being like, you know, this is a really good video. Um, they're they're a new channel, but it's still good video, and we're noticing a pattern of like these same team, 10 people watching it. So we'll serve it to more of those people. I think that's different. I think that's like from a search engine, whereas TikTok is more of a social media, like we want to keep you here.

SPEAKER_00

I mean, that that that I don't know if that matters.

SPEAKER_01

No, it doesn't.

SPEAKER_00

I was just using TikTok as an example. What I was kind of going for was the idea that when you have a YouTube channel and you do something different, um, anything, like you try to make something different, you try to do this, your channel's not taken into account at all. And I think that your channel actually should be taken into account. I think that if you've been doing it for years and years and you have a huge collection of videos, and I think that whatever whatever this means, whether it's promoting videos, giving you leeway to see a new audience, how they handle um like guidelines, strikes are reported, and like everything, I think your whole channel should be taken into account because if you For what? For anything. Anything that involves so right now a creator can't do like if if Sara Dici with almost a million subscribers makes a video that's out of the norm, YouTube's gonna kill it because it's out of the norm. And it's not gonna really look at like, well, you've had like this channel for all these years and you've made all this, like it's not gonna take her channel into account before the algorithm just makes a decision. If you get a reported thing for a guideline strike or whatever, I mean, how many people with hundreds of thousands or millions of subscribers have you heard of who get locked out of their accounts or their channels deleted or whatever just because it's like, well, that's it triggered, it flagged it, so we have no control over that. It doesn't matter that you've been doing this for 10 years, it doesn't matter that you have 10,000, not 10,000 videos, it doesn't matter if you have a thousand videos, um, doesn't matter that everything you do is literally like G-rated and you know, high quality and all that kind of stuff. It's like even as an established channel, you're you're sort of treated the same as someone who just signed up today. And I think they should take the whole channel into account for any, I think the algorithm should take that into account. I think that promoting a video from a channel that's like, hey, this is an active channel that uploads regularly and uploads, you know, whatever it might be, this is appropriate content, inappropriate content, because there's people who want like edgy stuff and all that, taking that kind of stuff into account when things get surfaced and mixed up and shuffled, I think is important and it doesn't, it doesn't do it at all. And that I think that if I think that if people who had established channels knew that they could experiment and do things differently, and it's not gonna just risk killing the thing that they've built for years and years, maybe they would be able to do that more. Instead of just, I'm gonna start a new channel and start from scratch and upload three videos there and then get tired of that and not have that channel anymore. Like, how many dead channels are there out there just because people were scared to do something on their actual channel? I don't know.

SPEAKER_01

So, what was the question?

SPEAKER_00

Should YouTube take your full channel into account when making any sort of decision?

SPEAKER_01

I think YouTube would say yes to that. I think anybody would say yes.

SPEAKER_00

But they don't.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, but they can't. I don't think they have the manpower to be able to do that. I mean, every every single channel above 100,000 gets a YouTube rep. That's more than any of us.

SPEAKER_00

Like I don't I don't mean like manually. I just mean algorithmically you can't look at go like, okay, this person has released 50 videos this year. None of those videos have gotten a community guideline strike, none of those videos have, you know, been flagged for anything. This feels like it could be automated. Uh, none of those videos include like profanity or violence, like, you know, you can how stuff gets rated and sorted, which it feels like they're already doing. So that should kind of go like, hey, this is a channel that's like active, they're putting stuff out, they're building things, here's their average view thing. Okay. Um, it's almost like it builds you up a level of trust or credibility with the platform versus it does nothing in terms of building up your trust or credibility with the platform, unless you're one of those people that has I like if I were to think about what's her name, Susan.

SPEAKER_01

Like, if she were, if you were to ask her this question right now, I would think that she would say, of course we would want to do that. Logistically, though, I just don't think that it's possible unless you only did it for channels that are two million up. I just don't think it's possible. How do you turn that into the algorithm? There's so there's like way too many factors. I mean, you could do like, okay, has a channel gotten a strike before?

SPEAKER_00

I don't mean, I don't, it doesn't have to necessarily do anything. It's all it's basically I'm talking about taking info that's already in there. Like YouTube already knows how often you upload videos, it already knows what your videos literally every frame of your video contains, every word, every syllable, it knows what all that stuff is. So using that to build a profile of your channel that can then be used to like give, you know, like it's like if you go to Team YouTube's Twitter and there's people saying, Hey, my channel got deleted, give it back. And then Team YouTube will be like, uh, upon reviewing your channel, it looks like it was deleted because you violated a thing. And then if you sometimes go click on those people's channel, you'll be like, Oh yeah, you were just uploading like ripped-off scenes from Marvel movies. Like you were breaking all kinds of like like guidelines in terms of service. Of course, you should get deleted. That's not a lot of credibility versus when somebody who, you know, again, somebody who has an established channel, they want to stick on the platform, they wanna. I am speaking selfishly from like what I would like to have. It's like you work at this for years, you've built something up. I would like to continue to do that. I know that they can't guarantee, like, well, because you've been doing it for a long time, you're always gonna get this much engagement or you're always gonna get this much revenue. Of course not. But to just know that like it means something to the platform to have invested that much time, energy, and effort into it. So now as a creator, when I want to experiment or if I accidentally do make a mistake with something or whatever, I'm not like suddenly fearing for my like.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I think that's that I think if they could, they would. That that I because I agree with you. I totally agree with you, but I just think that if they could, they would. Um, I think also you know, just to play devil's advocate here, um YouTube's free, you know, like there's a lot of benefits that I think that are hard to see that like you know, are are not being taken into account. The other thing is like if if you're if you're coming at it from you know. We don't want to we want to encourage creators to keep being creative, right? Like they shouldn't be punished for creating content, even though that content new. Yeah, for trying and I totally agree with that. But also if you're at the point where your channel um if you upload content where punishment, like some kind of punishment would even be info influential to your brand, then you are a business at that point. And you should be starting a business or coming up with any other product line just like any other damn business has since the beginning of time. Well, do research, build it from scratch, try something new. Like you've you've built your house, you've you've done it here with you know these factors, and if you want to do it again, then I I believe that you could take the risk just like everyone has, just like you did the first video, or you slowly try to incorporate it with what you have.

SPEAKER_00

I agree and disagree. Um, because I think you're right, yeah. If you want to take a left turn on something, then you gotta start over. If you do camera reviews and you want to do cooking.

SPEAKER_01

Like what she could have done was alright, I'm doing Vlogmas members only. Cool, then it's not even an issue.

SPEAKER_00

Right, right, right, but then it's not even an issue. But my point is in that case, so the Vlogmas example for like the videos weren't super out of left field. They were just like kind of different, but still related to, you know, like one's a studio tour setup video. Like that seems very related to whatever, but it's still like now it's getting tangled. So okay, it's this thing here.

SPEAKER_01

Question for you then. So say the algorithm says, okay, here's a channel, here's Sarah DC's channel, and she's been historically creating this type of content that gets served to historically this type of viewer. And now she's uploading a Vlogmas video that is like totally random in the eyes of the algorithm, right? So if you're the algorithm and you have the chance to serve content to new viewers, do you serve them content from us or do you serve content from Sarah's channel, even though it has nothing to do with with what she's historically uploading uploading?

SPEAKER_00

Ultimately, I know that from YouTube's point of view, they say that the whole point is that the algorithm gives the viewer what the viewer wants to see. So they really don't care if it's a new channel, an old channel, whatever. It's like if there's somebody who's gonna really like a Vlogmas video, we'll give them that. We don't care who made it, they want to see a Vlogmas video. Um, and that's ultimately like, yeah, it should serve the viewers because it's a platform to view stuff on. Um, so I'm not against that. It's just the like, I I mean, I had this thought six weeks ago, so like it's not as fully formed now as it was then.

SPEAKER_01

I mean, I see what you're saying, and I totally agree. I think that, you know, I think that it it shouldn't okay. I know this is a ridiculous example, but like PewDiePie can make a video about literally whatever.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Absolutely whatever. Uh, because he is at that point. And I think that there are, you know, that's why I say two million up. Um, there are a lot of channels who I think a lot of the channels that are two million plus took a long time to get there. Like, of course, there's the viral channels, but I think a lot of them have been around for years and they've made, you know, lots of videos. Um I agree that, you know, if they want to try something new, like shorts or uh, you know, something else, like that would be great if they could without without feeling like they can't for whatever reason, that it wouldn't be detrimental to, you know, their income and their subscriberships and all of that. But I just think that that's like it's like asking for world peace. Well, this is how I see it.

SPEAKER_00

I I think you brought up a good point when you said YouTube's free, because YouTube is free, you get to do all this stuff for free, all these tools. You can start 15 different channels for free.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And I think that that is probably always important to remember. Um the the thing where it's like it's it's just sort of interesting to me, and I don't have an answer to this, is when you get to that point where, yeah, you are making a living on YouTube or whatever. But also, if you're doing that, that means that YouTube's always making more money than you are. So do I have no value to the platform then at that point? I know it's like it's it's free and it's not up to them, but they are making money off of what you create. Those two million channel, two million subscriber channels or whatever, like I I guess they're just so much that YouTube doesn't need to care about them individually because anyone can disappear and be and be replaceable. But it's like that is where at a certain point, hey, if you want like if we're in a world where platforms are competing with each other for audiences and for creators, maybe, maybe paying attention to the creators who, yes, even though it is free, who are kind of like investing in this and helping your platform grow, maybe that's something that's worth doing. And it's I'll stop having opinions after that.

SPEAKER_01

I have a rebuttal.

SPEAKER_00

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

I think creators, especially YouTube creators, only want one thing, or the data shows that they want one thing more than anything else.

SPEAKER_00

To be sponsored by NordVPN. This episode of the couple, no, I'm kidding.

SPEAKER_01

And that's money. Well, I mean So I think that more than views and subscribers and all of that, I think that creators have historically shown that the thing they care about the most and they think they the thing that they want more of is money. It's not creative freedom. It's not, you know, like, oh, let me try to do this new thing. It's all of it is like, how can I get more money? Um and I think that from where we're standing, of course, that's not what we want. But if I swear to God, if you went to YouTube headquarters and looked at their data, I'm sure they have the data. I think that it's like 99%, you know, would be, yeah, we want. And this is why all these platforms are, what are they doing? They're not necessarily improving their. I mean, I think they're always doing this in the background. Their explore tab, their home tab, their search tabs, their search functions, like discovery, all of that. I think they're always improving that. But the thing they talk about and promote the most is income and monetization tools. Now you've got YouTube memberships and tips and bits and super chats and whatever. Like every platform is trying to lure you to their platform, not because you're gonna have creative freedom, but because here's another way that you can monetize. Here's all the different ways. It's not just one way, right? We have this way and this way, and you can have you can have several streams of income, but just be on our platform and have it be all here because capitalism. Period.

SPEAKER_00

I guess that's the answer in the end. It's not the answer I wanted, but I guess that's the answer in the end.

SPEAKER_01

But I think like, but going off of what we said earlier, I think um this is why I think it's more important than ever for communities to build and grow. Not communities that are um, you know, owned by a creator, but mutual interest communities. So, like, you know, like I'd like to look at ours as a mutual interest community because it's not a fan, we don't look at it as like signed up for just create more if you're a fan of Heather and Tom or the Couples Table. You know, we see each other as an equal member of the Just Create More community, just like anyone else, you know, someone who joined today. Um, because we are YouTube creators and we have this philosophy and approach with how we see our content. Same thing with like, you know, a Discord server about female entrepreneurship or something like that, where it's not under like, you know, the the Tom Buck brand or the MKBHD brand, but like tech.

unknown

Right.

SPEAKER_01

iPhone tech or something like that.

SPEAKER_00

Like the genre, I don't know if that's the right word. Um Michal said, my current belief is if YouTube can sell ads, I can actually make this a little longer, and place the ads in front of your videos to get more traffic. If not, they won't promote you. I really think it's that simple. They've said that that's not like whether something's monetized or not doesn't affect it. But last year was it that now they can start put they said they can start putting ads on non-monetized videos. So even if you are a brand new channel and you're not monetized, you can still put ads on it, which people were upset about because like, what? I don't want ads on my video, you can still put ads on my video. But in a way, wouldn't that wouldn't that eliminate the like everything is then equal again? Because it's right. Why like if they're putting ads on everything, then at least for them, in a way, it might they might even not want you to monetize it because then they get the full cut, right? Yeah, I don't know. Um, there's a big discussion about MX keys and MX Master 3 mice and keyboards happening. I know Heather has the mouse. Um I I skipped over a lot of the discussion. I've been wanting, I have the Apple Magic keyboard, which I really like, but I'm constantly switching between my Mac Mini and my MacBook with it.

SPEAKER_01

And it's And the keys are different?

SPEAKER_00

No, the keys are the same, but to pair it, all the MX things you can easily use, like two or three devices with them. And like the MX keyboard, you just push a button, it'll switch to your next device. This, what you have to do, which only takes a second, is you just for half a second, you have to connect it via cable to the computer and it will pair it. You don't have to go to Bluetooth preferences and all that. Um, but every time I do it, I'm like, I have to like pull out the cable, plug it in. Okay, now it's paired here.

SPEAKER_01

Now I'm going over it, and it's like so the next thing Tom's gonna get is a keyboard.

SPEAKER_00

But I I like this keyboard though. I like the magic keyboard quite a bit. Um I think they probably make the algorithm do whatever they want it to do. I think so, but I think there is, I think very really like there is not one algorithm. There's many, many, and I think that it is very tough. You want to talk about what's not possible or what people would want to do. I think that even a brilliant engineer and designer or team can't anticipate all the variables that these things, how they're interacting with.

SPEAKER_01

Because if you add something, you're taking away something. Like you don't understand the rubric questions of you know, an edit to the algorithm. I'm talking like a no.

SPEAKER_00

This is all speculation, of course.

SPEAKER_01

Um uh let's see. Oh here, Jared.

SPEAKER_00

Jared, I think there is an issue because I think my channel gets hurt because I have a podcast and then a gear review, then a tutorial, then a podcast again, and so on. Yeah, and and that's weird.

SPEAKER_01

I mean, I have like five channels, so I completely I agree.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I mean, I know like I guess very typical YouTube advice would be like, well, your podcast should be a channel here, and then this, that, but it's like the Jared brand, yeah, it it it supersedes all that, and it all feels like different sides of the same thing to me, but I know I'm like maybe I'm too close to it, but it's like when I watch your tutorial But even Mr.

SPEAKER_01

Beast has like Mr. Beast, you know, the channel and Mr. Beast engagement.

SPEAKER_00

But I don't know if that's YouTube strategy, which I think it could be. So like MKBHD wanting to start a shorts channel instead of doing shorts on his main channel. I think it is like we have a channel of 15 million subscribers, it's been around for 13 years. We're not gonna throw a wrench in that.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, we're not gonna find a chance.

SPEAKER_00

I think I think that that's a very real thing that that channels of all different sizes can is very understandably deal with. I think there's also the part, especially if you're Mr. Beast, you can start a new channel, you know immediately it's gonna go one million gold play button, and that's an entirely new revenue stream. Um, and I think there's a part of that that lots of people do with when they get to that point where they can start new channels, not just because it makes sense, but because it opens up an entirely new world of revenue streams. For better or worse, I think that is something that that they do.

SPEAKER_01

But I think I get punished because YouTube doesn't know what to think, but I like to create what I want to and don't want to channel for each thing.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, and I mean part of that also comes back to like, well, if YouTube is a hobby versus a uh profession, then you know, the power you have if you to if if a YouTube creator is not looking to YouTube full time, the power they have is that the power of not caring because Right.

SPEAKER_01

Like, you know, you talk about this all the time. You you are following a 2500 subscriber channel who's like the visual effects guy on the expanse, which is a wonderful show, by the way. But he's a like professional industry visual effects person who, you know, works with the best of the best, but only has 2,500 subscribers. Um, and obviously probably doesn't care. That's not to say he's very excited.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, there's it's not like there's no thought into the content, but in terms of like, you know, I'm gonna do this full time, like that's obviously Yeah, he'll he'll do he'll do like here's a breakdown of how we did these effects, here's a tour of the set, here's just a a single image, but it's a 3D, you know, you can tour the ship by spinning your phone around or whatever. Right. Um strategy will be spread around YouTube, Rumble, Patreon, whatever, the content equal across them if a platform band's available enough, there's the content and happiness creating it is what matters. Wait, can you scroll up a little bit? Boo doop-doop-doop. Oh, yeah. Megan? I do wish YouTube could handle multiple types of content on one channel. That's also the same. Yeah, I mean, I know that is what it is. The thing that's funny to me though is I think of channels, the old school term on television. So you have Comedy Central, right? And Comedy Central in the name, probably gonna have comedy on it. But that might be a re that might be a rerun of Saturday Night Live, it might be a movie, it might be some stand-up specials, it might be South Park series, all these different shows and series and things on this one channel. Back when, like, you know, TLC was the learning channel and not just like human oddities channel. Um, it would be like, here's we're gonna learn about everyone stuff. It might be a historical event, it might be a science thing, it might be about animals, but every show is gonna be learning something, and the channel is all these different things, whereas YouTube is much, it's much, it's almost like each channel is a show. Like you like there there seems to be less variety in the show. Well, I see.

SPEAKER_01

I mean, that'd be great if you could subscribe to playlists, right? Right? Like, because then you could subscribe, like I want the couples table and then nothing else.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, so I'm gonna subscribe to Heather for the Couples Table, yeah, or I'm gonna subscribe to Heather for the pre-recorder videos, yeah. Or both.

SPEAKER_01

Um I've said that for years, but uh well, even Sarah with the Vlogmas videos, what she means when she says it's tanking her channel is that it's costing her money. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00

Well, it's costing her money, but it is, I mean, she shows the thing like people are leaving her channel, view to go down, but then it also carries over into how the videos are being served and the impressions that are going out and all that kind of stuff there, where it's like Yeah, and when you have a channel that you built up for 10 years, now you're doing this fun little experiment, but now it's gonna cut your revenue in half. That experiment's like way less fun.

SPEAKER_01

Oh, LG has one that charges with light, and it's so nice enough to have to plug it in. Couldn't agree more. I think the individual brand is a larger umbrella.

SPEAKER_00

Right. I mean that's yeah, the history channel. They don't have history programming anywhere, they have like ancient aliens and like it's all and pawn stars and like weird.

SPEAKER_01

Wow.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, History Channel went through that phase where it was only World War II, and then it went to like history stuff, and then it went, and now it's like fringe because it's like the QAnon channel. Like wow. Fringe conspires. Yeah, tinfoil hat network, tinfoil programming, and pawn stars.

SPEAKER_01

Well, as we're ending, coming to the end here, what do you guys think the future of content is? What do you think is gonna be a trend for 2020?

SPEAKER_00

These are just sort of random thoughts that I have, but I I was thinking, like, obviously, as you're thinking of what kind of content you want to make, you can't not think of how the platform handles it or which platform would be the one to do that with. Yeah. Oh, Kevin, it's almost as if the channel is now the show and a network is more of what a TV. Yeah, actually, that's probably more accurate. Um what did it do? Oh, it was calling in calling into Radio Stations Live music. Yes. Yes. That used to be, we used to do that all the time.

SPEAKER_01

1-800-520-1027.

SPEAKER_00

I don't remember what ours was, but I remember my friend and I in like middle school, we would every weekend we would call in and we would do fake dedications like this is from Tinky Winky to whatever, and we would do like a really dumb, like cheesy love song, and then the DJ would like say these cutesy pootsy names that we came up with, and like, and then we giggle. And we would record it with a tape player, and then we would play the tape back in double speed so it sounded like a chipmunk.

SPEAKER_01

Wow.

SPEAKER_00

This is what we did on our I know.

SPEAKER_01

This is pre-selvo.

SPEAKER_00

There was no TikTok in those days. It was just if you play the tape fast, the voice gets high. We listen to Smash Mouth All-Star at double speed.

SPEAKER_01

What do you find yourself like watching nowadays? Do you do you notice a trend? Like, what's still relevant, Tom?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, Mr. Trends over here.

SPEAKER_01

Tell us the things.

SPEAKER_00

In my world, I I still very heavily gravitate towards things that it feels like the creator has like they're having fun doing. So like MKBHD is one of my favorite examples because he has a freaking company. I clearly seven figures, probably eight figures, um, business, if not even beyond that. Uh, and ultimately, like, you can really see the same kid that was just making videos with like his webcam and his parents' house a decade ago. And so, even though the philosophy, I have no desire to have a team and a student and all that kind of stuff, I still connect with like the creative side of him. And and uh and I like that, and and he's he's been doing all kinds of cool stuff with like his new studio space. So I love that. Um I love just channels where the creators are where the creators have their fingerprints all over the channel, is like the thing that I like. And they're I don't know how to describe that, but that's something that I really, really love.

SPEAKER_01

Cool. Okay, also, what are TV channels now? If you think about the new streaming era, you go looking for a type of show, it doesn't matter what channel it was originally on, it only matters what you want to watch.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, now it's like I want to watch this. What stupid platform do I need to sign up for?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Do I already have it? Peacock, who has Paramount Plus? Like, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, things are going back to the 80s. I just binged Cobra Kai.

SPEAKER_00

Alrighty. Alrighty. Well, I guess it's time to clear the table. We never got special uh special visitors, special delivery visitors.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, but once it comes, probably you will know in the Just Create More community if you're there.

SPEAKER_00

Where is where is our oh there, I can add it now. I think it was this one. This was our like live cam delivery watch 2022.

SPEAKER_01

Um you know what I think is actually never. What do you what do you think about interviews?

SPEAKER_00

What do you mean? Do you think that's like I mean I think people call them podcasts, and obviously they're popular. Um it's cool. The hard part with that is sort of it's the same thing that we saw kind of with like people doing live stream and video things, is like, okay, interviews, so I'm gonna have I'm gonna interview you and do this, but then someone else in the C and be like, oh, I should interview too, and now you have done the same interview eight times.

SPEAKER_01

And it's like yeah, I hadn't I had to I had to stop doing interviews there for a while.

SPEAKER_00

Well, it's just like it's it's that same thing where like the initial novelty, the initial excitement is high, but how you keep that going, you know, and then I've seen a lot of people, you've done this, I think I've even wanted to do this, where it's like, well, instead of interviewing the people you'd expect, I'm gonna go find uh a completely different someone who has really valuable info to share or something really interesting, and I'm gonna interview them, but then people don't watch that or listen to it because they don't know who the person is. And it's like you want to get to the point where people just trust you, where they're like, I don't know what Heather's doing, but I know I'm gonna like it, so I'll just watch it and I'll trust her because I like everything she makes. And I there's definitely a few creators like that that I watch where it's like like Cathod Ray Dude is one whose channel has blown up recently. Um, he'll make a video that's like, here's a fax machine from 1991. And I'm like, I couldn't care less about fax machines, but I'll watch this 45-minute video and I know I'm gonna enjoy it. Um, but it's it's so hard to cultivate that though as a creator. Totally. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

What about you? What do you watch? I haven't been watching YouTube lately.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, you you do not watch you. I even even yesterday was like, oh, watch you just watch a video, it's really fun. You're like, I don't watch videos for fun.

SPEAKER_01

I see this is why. Like, I don't want to necessarily call myself a YouTube coach anymore, because I I don't I don't know. I don't know. I don't know to say I was gonna say Kevin. Tom and I are taking uh because Kevin Oh uh your brother's also Kevin. Yeah, Tom and I are taking Casey Neistat. We signed up for this course, which is it has been awesome so far. I you know, I'm kind of hoping that will help me find my voice again and get back into the the swing of things. Um but right now it's just been a lot of anime and video games of like not content creator stuff.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Um I think the short form content will start to die down because we have had long form content for years, and I don't really think short form content will just explode and the long form content will die.

SPEAKER_00

There's room for both, and it ultimately I think they just settle into like Yeah, it's just like live streaming is not gonna go away.

SPEAKER_01

I think there's like, oh my god, let's go live. Uh, and that's also gonna die down, but I don't think live streaming will ever go away. Just like I think too amazing, it's a it's a it's a different format, you know. So I think that they're all here to stay in terms of platforms. I don't know.

SPEAKER_00

But Rob said fax machines still matter, but he does work in the medical industry also, where everything needs to be faxed.

SPEAKER_01

Still? It's like so much paper.

SPEAKER_00

When I was a little kid, I used to think that when something was faxed, that paper itself was sent. Because the first time I saw a fax machine.

SPEAKER_01

That's adorable.

SPEAKER_00

I thought it was like the pneumatic tubes at the bank where it's like Oh my gosh. But it would go really far. Because the first time I saw one, uh, we were visiting my uncle in Southern California, and he got a fax machine, and my grandpa in Northern California had a fax machine, and they were trying to explain like this is like, yeah, he can send me a picture of something. And he like called my grandpa and was like, hey, can you send me a fax or like a picture of like your motorcycle or something? And then we waited and we heard all the beeping and the buzzing, and then suddenly, like, like paper came out that was like a very bad black and white picture of him and his motorcycle. And I thought that that paper had been sent from like San Francisco and traveled, like, and that was the paper like my grandpa had held. I didn't understand fax machines.

SPEAKER_01

I'm trying to find I had a picture of a fax that I've had for a really long time.

SPEAKER_00

A fax.

SPEAKER_01

I know. If you see it, you'll know, but I don't think I'm gonna find it.

SPEAKER_00

Uh yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So anyway.

SPEAKER_00

Just the facts. You could you could do short form content about it.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, no, I don't have it anymore.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, I'm gonna sleepy. So. With that we said, it's definitely time to clear the table. And oh yeah, I can play the outro music. There it is.

SPEAKER_01

All right, we'll see you guys next week.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, hope you have a safe, happy, healthy, fun rest of your week. We will see you around. Bye.